07-07-2016, 01:55 AM
montana Wrote:Stanc to say your unyielding is an understatement lol.Heh, heh. "Pot calling kettle..." :p
Quote:For you to dismiss the writings and thoughts of the actual creators of the Second Amendment is quite disingenuous on your part especially if you were sincere about the true meaning of gun rights. It would be like people discussing "arguing" about the meaning in a novel and then totally dismissing the authors remarks on the very novel he wrote. Not very logical if I do say so.Well, first off, there was only one creator of the Second Amendment (and the rest of the Bill of Rights): James Madison.
As for what contemporaries of Madison thought, instead of cherry picking quotes to support your position, let's look at the gun rights that were actually incorporated into State constitutions before Madison wrote the Bill of Rights.
Delaware: That a well-regulated militia is the proper, natural and safe defence of a free government.
Maryland: That a well-regulated militia is the proper and natural defence of a free government.
Massachusetts: The people have a right to keep and bear arms for the common defence.
New Hampshire: A well regulated militia is the proper, natural, and safe defence of a state.
North Carolina: That the people have a right to bear arms for the defence of the State...
Pennsylvania: That the people have a right to bear arms for the defence of themselves and the state...
Vermont: That the people have the right to bear arms for the defence of themselves and the State...
Virginia: That a well-regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper, natural, and safe defence of a free state...
Tabulating the results, we have:
3 for the defense of a free State.
3 for defense of the State.
2 for defense of the State and defense of the individual citizen.
Conclusions.
The majority did not place quite the importance upon the "free" State idea that some of you insist has so much significance.
The majority addressed only collective defense (arming the militia for defense of the State, free or not).
Only two -- a small minority -- specified that individual self-defense was a reason for the right to keep and bear arms.