Who makes the fastest trigger?

[Zeneffect]

Who makes the fastest trigger for ar?

Fast as in, I pull and the time it takes from hammer to release to hitting the firing pin.

[monkeybutler]

Post edited so i don’t seem as dumb.

[BowChamp]

Who makes the fastest trigger for ar?

Fast as in, I pull and the time it takes from hammer to release to hitting the firing pin.

Lock Time is what you seek.

[tdbru]

ZE,
yes, BC is correct, the term you're looking for is "lock time"

if you believe wikipedia, it has a list of approximate lock times. you'll note the AR is at the bottom of their list:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lock_time

i suspect the only way to improve the lock time is to go with a low mass (Titanium?) hammer and a stiff hammer spring. the stiff hammer spring will have the effect of increasing the trigger pull weight.

follow through (part of which is keeping the cross hairs on targets as long as possible after the trigger releases the hammer) is more important on an AR due to the slower lock time. flinches have a bigger effect too for the same reason.

due to trigger/hammer design, i don't know if a Ti hammer would exhibit enough wear resistance to prevent the sear notch from wearing out more quickly than a steel / case (surface) hardened hammer.

i don't recall seeing any Ti hammers for sale so there must be a reason other than cost. some people are willing to spend whatever it takes to gain a competitive advantage in their sport shooting events, rules allowing of course. i have seen some hammer designs that appear to be of lower mass than a GI hammer which should improve lock time, but as far as i know they're still steel.
-tdbru

[StoneHendge]

tdbru, the lack of titanium hammers is likely a friction thing. I've been running a ti bolt carrier in my 6ARC and it needs to be run wet and lubed before each session. If I don't, even the pull of the charging handle requires more effort - and I'm pulling it against a reduced power spring and light weight buffers. I've been meaning to Google it and you finely reminded me while I was on my screen. Ti's coefficient of friction is apparently 3-4 times that of steel. So that candy cane break of a Geissele might turn into a pretzel rod with a Ti hammer......

[Zeneffect]

Yes lock time, thanks. The words eluded me, so who has the fastest on the market? I hear about hiperfire and the timney Calvin being quick

[Klem]

tdbru, the lack of titanium hammers is likely a friction thing.... Ti's coefficient of friction is apparently 3-4 times that of steel. .

SH,

This is very interesting, I did not know this. Excellent, thanks for sharing.

[Silverjay]

I might be remembering incorrectly, but I think I read last year that the lighter weight titanium hammer wasn’t heavy enough with a standard springs to reliably ignite primers.

[PVBoom]

I think your "fastest" is going to turn out to be your lightest.

I was killing time at PA Wednesday and they had triggers to tryout. There was Geissele, Rise and CMMG (IIRC). By far the lightest was the Geissele Super Dynamic 3 gun. It was lighter than I prefer by far, hard to find the break without exceeding it.

[Shiftyk5]

Geissele Hi-Speed National Match trigger is what you are looking for. And also, as another poster said. Follow Through.

[Redraider]

^^^^ this

Redraider

[Happy2Shoot]

The trigger is only the first part. You still have to send the firing pin. I think they do make light weight firing pins. No idea if any of this matters.

The Geissele Hi-Speed National Match trigger at 2 pounds is a fantastic trigger. Be really careful buying one, you will like it so much you will end up putting them on all your AR's $$$.

[Zeneffect]

I have psa titanium firing pins in my rifles, not much difference honestly. Was hoping for some technical discussion from this thread with some hard data and to why A is better than B, rebuttal, etc. The kind of healthy forum discussion you can reference back to when thinking about parts selection.

[LR1955]

I have psa titanium firing pins in my rifles, not much difference honestly. Was hoping for some technical discussion from this thread with some hard data and to why A is better than B, rebuttal, etc. The kind of healthy forum discussion you can reference back to when thinking about parts selection.

ZE:

Here is something you can do. Look at the winners of national and international IPSC, Steel Challenge, and Three Gun events and see if they say what trigger and hammer / spring they are using in their centerfire AR's. They will be after the most reliable and probably fastest lock time. I would use what the majority of the big time winners are using. Would also save me a bunch of time trying to figure it out myself.

LR55

[LRRPF52]

Tom Beckstrand did a good article on this which was mainly addressing pre-ignition disturbances to the rifle from a perspective of chasing precision in the AR15.

The AA skeletonized FCG, Geissele, and LaRue triggers all did the best.

Several triggers have hit the market since then.

It really depends on if you’re chasing split times for 3-Gun or more of a precision set-up.

I personally use LaRue MBT-2S the most over the past few years.

[biodsl]

The AA skeletonized FCG...

My favorite trigger. The thin, blade trigger is just the thing for shooting in gloves. I just found a new, old stock on Gunbroker so I'd have a second.

[Zeneffect]

Well, I went ahead and ordered the Timney Calvin Elite to replace a Larue mbt2s. I also have a rise armament in another and another larue mbt2s in yet another. I'll be able to side by side all 3.

How do I accurately measure lock time now to get real sharable data rather than going by the butt dyno. High-ish speed camera (phone slo-mo) and high resolution timer?

[LR1955]

Well, I went ahead and ordered the Timney Calvin Elite to replace a Larue mbt2s. I also have a rise armament in another and another larue mbt2s in yet another. I'll be able to side by side all 3.

How do I accurately measure lock time now to get real sharable data rather than going by the butt dyno. High-ish speed camera (phone slo-mo) and high resolution timer?

What difference does it make if one firing system is a microsecond faster than the other? You can probably change out firing pins and see a change in lock times.

Shoot them and choose the one you think is best for your purposes.

LR55

[Redraider]

I love this, a guy asks a question, gets plenty of response, and goes and buys one not mentioned...............why ask?

Redraider

P.S. Go to Geissele's web site, watch his video and explanation on his match trigger, listen to what he says about quality of mfg, and durability of trigger(life span of trigger) and maybe you'll get the answers to the questions you asked!

[Oso Polaris]

I own a few of the Geissele triggers and they are hard to beat. The SSA-E is my go to drop in trigger for general purpose. I have the 3-Gun model and the straight blade is nice. Honestly, unless you have Miculek finger speed you aren't going to notice the difference between lock-up speed on most of the top tier triggers.

The Geissele National Match is a totally different experience. It will catch you off-guard with how light it is... the 2# is deceptive. This would not be my trigger of choice for run & gun shooting game... likely to have a negligent discharge. Its that nice and smooth!!!!