20" vs. 24"

[Lonehill]

Still trying a year and a half later to put a Grendel together. Mainly I want a rifle that I can shoot coyotes, deer, hogs with and also bang steel out to say 800. I hit consistently at 600 with .22-250 and would like try at 800 with 6.5. Wanted to know if 20" barrel really sacrifices much as compared to the 24". I've had a 22" on order now forever and have said to hell with it because apparently the manufactures only crank out 20 and 24 in big runs. Disclaimer: I know the topic has probably been beat to death and there's gonna be some people get all butthurt that it's brought up again but I literally don't have the time to wade through every forum topic on the net. Don't need the whole "search is your friend" fiasco, so no need to comment if you're one of those guys. Just after some quick solid info from the helpful.
Looking at the MidwayUSA Satern barrels that are soon to be back in stock. I know there will be some loss in MV. I'm not really all that concerned about weight, I'll gladly pack an extra 4 inches of barrel IF it's justified by extended range/accuracy. However, if the 20" really doesn't give up a whole lot then I'll definitely consider it. Thanks

[txgunner00]

You don't give up much from 24" to 20", especially for a field rifle IMO. I've had a 20" for quite a while and it's been about all I want to carry on long stalks. 800 yds is no problem, 1000 yds is on the edge and weather conditions have a big effect on how it performs. Now that I have a .30 cal suppressor I built a 12" for field use and the 20" is mainly used for range play and the rare occasion when I hunt from a stand. I do have plans to eventually build a 24" but it will only be a range toy.

[cory]

You do sacrifice something, it's weight. Go with the 20" and save some weight. You'll appreciate that decision.

A 24" AR is just to long to be lugging through the woods. IMHO 20" is borderline. Either way go with a light profile like the AR740.

[CPT.CRAZY]

I say build both! But realistically 20" will shoot out to 800 lrrpf52 shot his16" at 1200yrds. Its all about you preference. Personally I have a 24, 20, and 18" I can't really tell the accuracy difference in any of them.

[bwaites]

First, longer does NOT equal more accurate. In truth, short and stiff is the most accurate. BUT....you do give up muzzle velocity, and at long range, less velocity equals more wind drift. Between 20 and 24 inch barrels you are talking a roughly 60-100 FPS velocity shift, so run some ballistics tables and decide if the trade is worth it to you.

I have a 16, 20 and 28" Grendel, skipping the 24 because there just wasn't a big enough justification over the 20".

At 800, the 20" is at its limits, at least at sea level, as far as I can determine. LRRPF52 shoots way up high at 5-7000 feet, and gets great results out of his 16". Of course he also hits steel at 1500 Yards shooting from the kneeling position with .338, too! YMMMV!

[Drifter]

Still trying a year and a half later to put a Grendel together. ... I've had a 22" on order now forever and have said to hell with it because apparently the manufactures only crank out 20 and 24 in big runs.

If 22 is what you really want, buy a 24 if available and let Adco cut, crown, and thread it. Their turnaround is usually ~10 days or less.

In several instances, I've purchased 20's, then let Adco cut to 18, as my preference is 18 with rifle-length gas. Having a standard offering altered is usually much quicker than waiting on a custom order.

[tackdriver]

I've had both, kept a 24" bull. I wish I had kept a 20", much more versatile

[sneaky one]

I've had my 20"--- 3/4" diam. bbl. for 6 yrs. Really like the accuracy, yet I'm thinking of a lighter option , as a walk- stalk gun.,, almost need 2 Grendels here.

Lonehill , What's your main usage- stands , or walking , or just targets ?

24" is too much to carry around on a 3 day walk , stalk hunt wknd.

TD- if I ever decide to sell my 20" bbl- interested?

[lrgrendel]

A 24" does everything a 20" does so why buy a 20" unless you are hiking all over mountains some where. (Not too many hogs in the mountains!!)
A 24" will definitely do better than a 20" out to 800 yds. I shoot an AA 24" Overwatch out to a 1000 yds at sea level, a buddy has a 20", he wished he had longer!

BTW There is one on Gunbroker right now for $799, cheaper than Midway!

May not be as accurate as a Satern but a I am very pleased with mine.

Hope this helps

[lrgrendel]

A 24" does everything a 20" does so why buy a 20" unless you are hiking all over mountains some where. (Not too many hogs in the mountains!!)
A 24" will definitely do better than a 20" out to 800 yds. I shoot an AA 24" Overwatch out to a 1000 yds at sea level, a buddy has a 20", he wished he had longer!

BTW There is one on Gunbroker right now for $799, cheaper than Midway!

May not be as accurate as a Satern but a I am very pleased with mine.

Hope this helps

[Lonehill]

Thanks for all the replies! Lots of good info here. Really seems to me like the 22" fills a void, that's why I wanted to go with it. The barrel maker acted like it was no big deal, could have any length I wanted AND threaded for the same money. Want to get a .30 cal suppressor (which would get cleared by the ATF quicker than you can get a barrel!!!), so already threaded was a big selling point. They could've told me that they'd never get around to making it though and that a 20 or 24 would be readily available. Not gonna cancel my order but I gotta do something in the meantime. Just wish they'd been straight up with me. I've got a Mega side charger and gonna put a Leupold 4.5-14X50 Long Range scope on, 30mm tube I had leftover from a 7mag Sendero I traded off. Also going to swap over on a lower with UBR. So this things already gonna be heavy. I never shoot deer long shot without a solid rest, not ethical, mostly blinds or over hood on bipod. My wife's gonna use it a lot on deer, she's over 6' so she can pack it around LOL . But I want to go ahead and get this thing together so she can practice up enough before this fall/winter. I'm thinking the 20 would surely fill the bill. Do you think it would be hard to sell the 20" Satern barrel after putting a couple hundred rounds down it, I take REALLY good care of my rifles. I've got 30 yr old bolt actions I've took hunting every year that you'd swear are new.

[cory]

Assuming you can find a buyer that'll still buy a Satern barrel, it should hold its value well.

That being said, I wouldn't build a rifle with a Satern barrel if it was donated to me.

[Lonehill]

Assuming you can find a buyer that'll still buy a Satern barrel, it should hold its value well.

That being said, I wouldn't build a rifle with a Satern barrel if it was donated to me.

Ok....Want to elaborate a little? Now you got me wondering. See, I chose to go with Satern based on reviews and posts on this forum. I certainly didn't see anything bad about them a year ago when I placed my order. Good folks with a top end product, I'll help the little mom and pop anytime I can. What's the concerns? My only beef so far is with the customer service. Honestly at this point, even if they come through on my barrel I'm never going to place another order with them again. I've asked repeatedly for an eta, finally got an e-mail saying they just don't know. That to me is not acceptable. They'd rather be filling big production runs for Midway and running their Liberty line. Is it a quality concern as well?

[NugginFutz]

And... Here we go again. Lonehill, you can do a forum search for a couple of threads on the Satern group buy to get your answer. It will answer your question and more.

Note that it is going to be an extensive read.

[bwaites]

In a nutshell:

Satern used to supply barrels to Alexander Arms. They no longer do.

They decided to use a Non-SAAMI reamer for their barrels, and a group buy here using that reamer showed mixed results.

They did not handle the subsequent issues to the satisfaction of some of the members here, thus leading to hard feelings.

The simple truth is that buyers should get what they expect to get. Anyone buying directly from a barrel maker should be sure that they are getting what they expect.

[Lonehill]

In a nutshell:

Satern used to supply barrels to Alexander Arms. They no longer do.

They decided to use a Non-SAAMI reamer for their barrels, and a group buy here using that reamer showed mixed results.

They did not handle the subsequent issues to the satisfaction of some of the members here, thus leading to hard feelings.

The simple truth is that buyers should get what they expect to get. Anyone buying directly from a barrel maker should be sure that they are getting what they expect.

Thank you bwaites, I definitely don't want to kick a hornets nest here! Would a new production satern be saami spec, true Grendel? I'd willingly go with another maker if I could get a comparable barrel for the around the same price. Done waiting. The barrel I ordered quoted $583 full fluted, bead blasted, and threaded. Who else is GTG in/around this price range for a comparable barrel?

[Lonehill]

Barrel I ordered is quoted at $583, 22" .875 gas block. Looking at PF website, looks like I can only get a barrel .750 or .936 bull. Bartlein runs $690 w/o fluting or threading, total with options $925. Lija is $825 fluted/threaded. I work for a living, this is just too damn high.

[Jakal]

I just ordered a Lilja 20" AR740 fluted with muzzle cap for $650.00. Received it July 17th and just finished the upper build. They are good barrels and are in stock. You might want to think about it. They worked with me on a 50/50 payment over a two week period.

They may do the same for you if you call them. I was told if they are not low on stock, that they would work with you.

[ThatRandomGuy]

Would a new production satern be saami spec, true Grendel?

Long story short: no. You'd get either a questionably unsafe chamber, or one akin to the LBC. If you weren't opposed to the LBC-esque chamber, they a 24" barrel + bolt for $330 on midway as the Grendel II (Satern makes the Grendel Stoner barrels).

The barrel I ordered quoted $583 full fluted, bead blasted, and threaded. Who else is GTG in/around this price range for a comparable barrel?

Shilen sells a 20" barrel and bolt for $500 I believe. Unthreaded though, which would bring it up to $575, which is the same price as the 18" that's already threaded. Both would be .750 and neither would be fluted (I believe), unfortunately, but they should be fairly quick about it and have a unmarred reputation. 18 would probably be enough for hunting, and light enough for carrying. Maybe not exactly what you were looking for, but they're there.

[Walter]

Lonehill call mark at pf. See what he can do for price. Sometimes he has barrels that are not on the website. If you get something from you will be happy.