95 gr VMax

[CJW]

Good write up LazyE.

[BliksemDonder]

+1. good for what it's designed for. All the more reason to have more than 1 gun!!


(ps, the wife has lots of pairs of shoes... like the Larry Potterfield ad!)

Depends on yoru interests and setting. 6.5 Grendel was designed to be the most potent round you can fit into a small frame AR15 platform. And so it is. But in the end, it's stil about 28 gr of gunpower power Comparing it to a .308 or other larger class rounds that run 40 gr of gunpowder power, is obviously a stark comparison. The trade off is with those game rounds, you have to run a heavy frame rifle. With bolt-action, not so big a deal; and one reason I wold never bother with a bolt-action 6.5 Grendel. But if ou want a a self-loading rifle (again, the entire point of Grendel), then that gets into a whole separate classification of rifle and management. For example, I run my 6.5 Grendel hunting rig with a light weight 14.5" pin and weld barrel, and light weight Hogster Thermal. The system allows me to one-hand glass my night-zone while I'm walking, with that rifle. While my left hand is carrying the tripod for fast deployment. I can't dream of doing that with a .308 class rifle. And this system gives me 27 rounds in teh gun, if I so choose (rarely do I). More importantly, it's a system that allows fast follow-up shots if I am engaging multiple targets, or the first shot needs a follow-up. The 6.5 Grendel is the only hunting rifle I've ever used, where I was able to fire a successful follow-up shot onto game and drop it right there.

but in the end, it's still just 28 gr of gunpowder. It's the most power you can get in an AR15, and it IS effective, with 800/1000 ft-lb of energy going out quite a ways. but really, to me, if I'm hunting deer, it's a 200 yard gun - not a 400 yard gun. It'll work at 400 yards, but that better be a good shot. I would not take it on an african safari. I would take it as my first choice for a night hunting rifle, as well as for a wide distance 200 yard staking deer rifle, which I do.

I do agree that it is a nice compromise cartridge and appreciate what it can do, within it’s limits. However, for hunting applications here in Deep South Texas I prefer the 450 Bushmaster as I sometimes run into Nilgai. The stopping power of the 450BM is quite impressive on these animals. Ranges rarely exceed 150yards where I walk and stalk hunt BTW.

[BliksemDonder]

+1. good for what it's designed for. All the more reason to have more than 1 gun!!


(ps, the wife has lots of pairs of shoes... like the Larry Potterfield ad!)

I have been accused of collecting gun safes, not true, I need them to secure the rifles and pistols I own!

I went down the rabbit hole a few years ago and have been collecting not only every caliber upper for the -15 platform but also the -10 platform. These things are quintessential American machines and the choices are staggering when faced with decision time when going hunting. (As a legal immigrant I had not been exposed to these before, BTW.)

My 2 old faithful rifles that always go on the long trips are a Ruger M77 in 458 WM and Marlin 444. Taking any MSR along is as secondaries with the 300Hamr and 458Win being useful.

[8Crow]

8Crow, I loaded up some 95 grain VMAX's for last deer season. I was in search of something that would do good tissue damage at longer ranges with the Grendels lower velocities. My load was 30 grains of IMR 8208 XBR in Starline brass with CCI 450 primers and an overall length of 2.230". My chrony showed 2693 to 2715 from an 18" Bartlein barrel (fouled) at 65 degrees F. Was getting about .65" 5 shot group at 100 yds.

My wife and I shot 7 does with that load last season, 6 dead and one that got away (one of mine). I'm going by memory but I'll try to descibe each of the shots. The first was a mature doe I shot broadside at about 100 yards. Double lung hit, she traveled about 80 yards. Not any blood where she was when hit. I ended up seeing her before I ever saw a good enough blood trail to track. There was a decent amount of blood where she was laying and I didn't back track the trail due to fading light. When I field dressed her there was a lot of dammage in chest cavity and it was full of blood and lung tissue, bullet did not exit.

The second deer, a yearling doe,was shot by my wife at approximately 25 yards quartering away. Deer made it about 5 steps and DRT. No exit on that one either, shrapnel in off shoulder.

The third deer was a yearling doe I shot at 237 yards that was slightly quartering away. She made it about 25 yards and had the same wound caracteristics as the last doe, no exit.

The fourth doe was a mature doe shot by my wife at about 125 yards broadside. That doe ran about 60 yards. She didn't leave an immediate blood trail and I could see her before I did pick up any blood. She was double lung shot with no exit hole and a lot of blood in the chest cavity upon field dressing.

The next doe shot was a mature doe facing me at about 100 yards. At this time I decided to see if that bullet would work on a shot that had more and tougher body mass to penetrate before it got into vitals. I placed the shot in the chest while she was facing me hoping bullet would make it into the chest cavity. Shot was a rested shot and I felt like it was a good shot when the trigger broke. Upon going to where the deer was standing when shot there was a good blood trail starting 5 yards from where she was standing. Long story short I never recovered her and lost blood trail about 200 yards into the track.

The next two does I shot were neck shots at about 30 and 40 yards. Both were mature does and both were DRT. Later that year I gut shot a coyote that ran by me at about 40 yards. There were intestines sprayed into the brush where he ran past. He made it about 10 yards serious damage to coyote.

I will not be using the 95 grain VMAX's for this up coming deer season because I don't think it can be trusted with any shot. Works great for a perfect broadside and quartering away, but I wouldn't try a quarteing to shot after my experience with the frontal shot. None of the recovered does that ran left great blood trails due to no exit hole.

Previously I have used 123 Hornady SST's and have had good luck but don't feel like they will open up well at around the 300 yard and beyond. I'm going to try 100 and 123 ELD's next hoping they are a little more destructive at longer range than the SST, but not so explosive I don't get an exit.

Hope this helps!

Wow, that is much more experience than I guessed I might get, much appreciated! Your experience is more or less what I was expecting and I would agree with your conclusions. I'd really like to find something else that's light but made for hunting deer-sized game--something around 90-100 grains. I'm not finding much beyond these 95 vmax's and 120 gr stuff, though. I need to do a little digging on here and see what the consensus is on the lighter Maker bullets.

[VASCAR2]

Double Naught Spy had good results with 100 grain Nosler Partitions on hogs. I have read post from forum members from southern states who used 100 grain Nosler Ballistic Hunting bullets on deer. Some of these deer are smaller than other parts of the country.

[Ranchmanager]

Mike038

Thanks for the wealth of information on your season last year. I bought mine for deer hunting and occasional hogs. /looks like I'll try the 123 grain Hornady SST or the ELD match this season.
I retired my 30-06 after 32 seasons for the Grendel. Most of my shots are 100 yards or less. Sling one down range on steel is quite different than an animal for me. Ethical kills shots are of the utmost importance. Let a porker step out and I'll sling one at any distance, not so for deer.

Would love to hear from other members regarding their experience with Hornady 123 SST, Black 123 BTHP, or 123 ELDs. the ELD and BTHP are the most available factory ammo here. Still trying to find SST online.

Chris

[LRRPF52]

Great report, thank you.

<asbestos suit on>

All of the above tells me a story of not enough gun, not wrong bullet choice. I know I may be new to 65grendel but I have harvested game on 2 continents over 4 decades and so far am not impressed with the performance on game with this cartridge. Having to use just the right combination of ammunition under seemingly perfect conditions smacks of very niche capabilities. Been there, done that.

When you consider the cost of a hunting trip, or safari, that costs of serious $ and much travel then taken way more gun than might be needed is the wise choice. There is a reason the minimum cartridge in some parts of the world is 375H&H, it always works.

Flame away yea zealots, it is a nice cartridge but is not the bolts of Zeus.

<asbestos suit off>

Have a wonderful evening folks.

Ballistic equivalent of the 6.5x54 Mannlicher Shoenauer, which WDM Bell used to harvest everything on the African plains, along with 7x57 and .303 Enfield.

[BliksemDonder]

Ballistic equivalent of the 6.5x54 Mannlicher Shoenauer, which WDM Bell used to harvest everything on the African plains, along with 7x57 and .303 Enfield.

LRRPF52,

Looking at the data provided the 6.5 Grendel appears to be a good 100 yard cartridge if you use a specific 123gn bullet. Niche combination according to the data clustering, IMHO.

I’m sure that using the modern bullets and powders available today that the 6.5x54 MS will outperform the 6.5 Grendel as there is no replacement for displacement. In the same vein I have used the 6.5x55 Swede on a number of occasions on Nilgai & Kudu, no shortage of power with the cartridge and modern bullets from a 1908 CG 1896 Mauser.

The question is, what cartridge/rifle combination are you comfortable with and you are confident that it will get the job done when hunting whatever game you are planning to harvest? We do not need to please others in our choices and I respect your choices. As long as we follow the rule of law or land owner as to minimums I’m OK with your choices.

The 6.5 Grendel is a nice niche cartridge, IMHO and I will use it where I deem it appropriate, free country, my choice.

Have a great evening.

BLiksem Donder

[LRRPF52]

I get where you’re coming from, and I don’t think anyone has described Grendel as the hammer of Thor.

That said, I’d be interested to see comparable data on larger charge weight cartridges and look at the travel distance averages from the shot, at various engagement ranges.

The Scandinavian Moose Hunt survey has over 14,000 samples.

What they found with that was that the .45 bores had the least average travel distance from the shot, but represented a very small % of the overall bore diameters used.

6.5mm and 7mm were the next most efficient.

.30 bores were at the bottom, but represented about 50% of all bore diameters, mostly .308 Win, .30-06, and .300 WM.

The guys using .45 bores tended to be a lot more experienced shooters with many years of practice.

I don’t think the terminal performance is the main factor in the above data, but ability to shoot the rifle consistently and confidently enough to make good hits through the vitals.

6.5mm and 7mm are easier to do that with, while still providing plenty of projectile mass for deep penetration on moose. 6.5x55 Mausers in Scandinavia are typically shooting 156gr-160gr.

One hypothesis is that you would see similar numbers or maybe even worse with .300 Win Mag, due to bad shot placement being more common with it due to 1) recoil/muzzle blast sensitivity, 2) optics loss of zero/bad zeros, and 3) limited training opportunity due to 1 & 2 plus ammo cost.

For the US, 6.5 Grendel does a great job on facilitating easy hits through vitals on medium and medium-large game, with engagement distances more dependent on optics and altitude, not necessarily bullet weight.

The list of suitable hunting projectiles is pretty lengthy, not limited to just one or two bullets. 123gr A-MAX and 123gr SST have just been mass-produced at affordable prices most of Grendel’s life on the market.

Just in the 120+gr class, you have a lot of cup and core bullets that work similarly in that moderate impact velocity range.

120gr Nosler Ballistic Tip
120gr Speer Hot-Cor
120gr Sierra Pro-Hunter
123gr SST
125gr Nosler Partition
129gr SST
129gr Spire Point

For really impressive performance, the 129gr Accubond Long Range is excellent, as it expands down to 1300fps and has a very high BC.

[rickt300]

My use of the Grendel has been that the round for what I do with it is a good one. That being a varmint/hog gun mostly used at night. For the hogs recovery is not super important but I like it if the bullet does not exit so it doesn't endanger livestock of private property. Yes I can do this with a 223 but I sure seem to recover more hogs using the 6.5 and body hits. Same same for neck/head/spine hits. I deer hunt with a variety of different cartridges in rifles scoped or set up for various circumstances.