6.5 Grendel Federal Fusion 120 grain

[Bullseyetony]

https://youtu.be/MfucPuJ-e64

What you think?

[Double Naught Spy]

I think he fired one shot, not one series of shots, but just one shot into ballistics gel from close range and used that information compared with information from a completely different caliber and drew way too many conclusions performance of the round. "1" is the absolute minimum sample size you can have if you have a sample. We know he fired more shots, but apparently just not into gel. This does not seem uncommon for the channel.

I am not a big fan of drawing conclusions about the performance of a particular caliber/round based on the performance of another caliber of that round. Given that the same bullet does not always perform uniformly across calibers, I would consider drawing such conclusions to be invalid on the face of it...particularly when the other sample size is also just one.

The bullet got good penetration, but we knew that it would based on user experiences here.

With an average velocity of 2133 fps, it seems they were getting poor performance out of their 16" barrel. By comparison, I was getting 2480 fps out of my 18" ARP 5R barrel. 340+ fps seems like a lot of velocity loss for 2" of barrel.

I don't know that anything that he said is untrue. In fact, I think it may be generally correct (based on information gleaned elsewhere, such as this forum). I just don't think single shot evaluations tell the whole story, nor do drawing conclusions from the same bullet in other calibers. You just can't know that what is being said is representative or not.

I did like the Princess Bride line at the closing of the video.

[A5BLASTER]

I think he fired one shot, not one series of shots, but just one shot into ballistics gel from close range and used that information compared with information from a completely different caliber and drew way too many conclusions performance of the round. "1" is the absolute minimum sample size you can have if you have a sample. We know he fired more shots, but apparently just not into gel. This does not seem uncommon for the channel.

I am not a big fan of drawing conclusions about the performance of a particular caliber/round based on the performance of another caliber of that round. Given that the same bullet does not always perform uniformly across calibers, I would consider drawing such conclusions to be invalid on the face of it...particularly when the other sample size is also just one.

The bullet got good penetration, but we knew that it would based on user experiences here.

With an average velocity of 2133 fps, it seems they were getting poor performance out of their 16" barrel. By comparison, I was getting 2480 fps out of my 18" ARP 5R barrel. 340+ fps seems like a lot of velocity loss for 2" of barrel.

I don't know that anything that he said is untrue. In fact, I think it may be generally correct (based on information gleaned elsewhere, such as this forum). I just don't think single shot evaluations tell the whole story, nor do drawing conclusions from the same bullet in other calibers. You just can't know that what is being said is representative or not.

I did like the Princess Bride line at the closing of the video.

Agreed not enough sample size.

From my own usage of this round, it does indeed work well.

I'm also not understanding why his velocity was so low. The 16 inch AA barrels I have used would shoot it close to are just over 2400 fps.

My 12 inch is faster then his 16 inch with that ammo. I'm thinking he had the graph set up wrong and got some bad readings or he was pulling them down and working the load slower to get the speed he got for his testing. To test for min expansion speed perhaps?

[Bullseyetony]

Totally agree whit both of these post. I'm sure it would be a great hunting round. I have used the fusion in 6.5 CM in the past on deer at under 100 yards with good results so I'm sure as a hunting round this would be fine.

[Double Naught Spy]

Agreed not enough sample size.

From my own usage of this round, it does indeed work well.

I'm also not understanding why his velocity was so low. The 16 inch AA barrels I have used would shoot it close to are just over 2400 fps.

My 12 inch is faster then his 16 inch with that ammo. I'm thinking he had the graph set up wrong and got some bad readings or he was pulling them down and working the load slower to get the speed he got for his testing. To test for min expansion speed perhaps?

He has messed up on velocity data previously, IIRC correctly. The 2133 average fps would be equivalent to 140 yards down range from my rifle, but I don't now that he downloaded them for that reason given that he talked about it being fired at room distance, suggesting he wasn't simulating longer range impacts.

[Happy2Shoot]

Here is two more videos. 120 grain gold dot.

Go to 15:07 for the gel

[video=youtube_share;vvx2F0G5GvY]https://youtu.be/vvx2F0G5GvY?t=909[/video]

[Happy2Shoot]

Only allowed to post one video at a time I guess, lol.

[video=youtube;IL0Azxunrc4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IL0Azxunrc4[/video]

[bruceleroy]

Maybe Im a bit slow but is the Federal Fusion bullet a Gold Dot?

[Happy2Shoot]

I think Fusion and Gold Dot are the same.

[imaguy3]

I think Fusion and Gold Dot are the same.

very similar.. not identical

The boat tail on the Gold Dot is slightly different than the Fusion, Federal and Speer (both owned by the same parent company - ATK) list different BC numbers for the 140gr 6.5mm projectiles, with Gold Dot being higher.

Additionally I believe the Fusion has more aggressive skiving cuts on the nose, as well as the lack of the coating the Gold Dot has.

[A5BLASTER]

very similar.. not identical

The boat tail on the Gold Dot is slightly different than the Fusion, Federal and Speer (both owned by the same parent company - ATK) list different BC numbers for the 140gr 6.5mm projectiles, with Gold Dot being higher.

Additionally I believe the Fusion has more aggressive skiving cuts on the nose, as well as the lack of the coating the Gold Dot has.

The 120 gold dot also has a higher bc then the 120 fusion.

The fusion has a canalure where the 120 gold dot does not.

I believe the gold dot is also a lil harder on the bonded aspect of its design when compared to the fusion. After seeing results of both on game, the gold dot seemed to hold toghter better then the fusion. Also leading me to belive it's bonding process makes it harder.

Having used both, I like the gold dot more. But the fusion has done good for me.

[am4966]

You have to reload to use the 120gr Gold Dot, right? I’d really like to get some of that ammo for hunting.

[ported45]

very similar.. not identical

The boat tail on the Gold Dot is slightly different than the Fusion, Federal and Speer (both owned by the same parent company - ATK) list different BC numbers for the 140gr 6.5mm projectiles, with Gold Dot being higher.

Additionally I believe the Fusion has more aggressive skiving cuts on the nose, as well as the lack of the coating the Gold Dot has.

The difference is the Fusion is a bonded, jacketed bullet and the Gold Dot is a plated bullet where the plating bonds to the core.

[Mad Charlie]

And, according to Speer, the Gold Dots are HBN coated. They sure are slippery to hold on to.

[A5BLASTER]

The difference is the Fusion is a bonded, jacketed bullet and the Gold Dot is a plated bullet where the plating bonds to the core.

So they are both bonded.

[Bullseyetony]

I was referring to the factory ammo in the original post. I don't reload anymore.

[Old Bob]

I don't have any experience with Fusion bullets in 6.5 Grendel but I do with .270 Winchester. I shot an Antelope at an estimated 275 yards with a 130 grain Fusion bullet. It was a quartering shot from the back of the left rib cage & out the right shoulder. The heart & lungs were mush & the shoulder meat was hamburger. The exit wound was huge! I'd have no worries about using 6.5 Grendel Fusion ammo on Antelope, Mule Deer, whitetails or wild swine if they perform like the .270 Win. version.

120 grain Gold Dots have been on my "want to reload" list. Could be another stellar hunting bullet.

[Double Naught Spy]

One thing I have noticed with a lot of exit wounds from bullets on hogs and coyotes is that in many cases when the exit wound is so big or amazing, it is because the bullet has hit bone and it is the bone shards that are driving the super-sized wound more so than if the bullet had just gone through meat. This isn't detracting from the bullet, only that the resultant wound cavity depends on what it does or does not encounter going through the body.

[Happy2Shoot]

The Fusion and the Gold Dot are the same type construction bullet.

They are both electroplated with skives.

They are both made by Speer at the Lewiston, Idaho plant.

The Gold Dots are dusted with boron nitride.

[Double Naught Spy]

The Gold Dots are dusted with boron nitride.

Does that come from magical pixies? Seriously, what is a dusting of boron nitride supposed to be doing for the bullet. I looked it up and can't make heads or tails out of the chemical description as to how it would relative to ballistics.