So I have a new Grendel arriving. I plan on 100% handloading for this cartridge as I do of all my cartridges. Living in California I refuse to subject myself to background checks for ammo purchases. I plan to start with a 123gr OTM on top of CFE223. I plan on making a ladder in .3 gr increments looking for accuracy nodes. I have numerous loading manuals that I utilize in reloading and have yet to see this question answered in one of my manuals. My question is: what load or what percent of a max load should be used with hand loads when breaking in a barrel? Just enough to cycle it? Something more than that? It seems kind of crazy work up a ladder until the barrel is properly broken in. I know this is a weird question because normally I would just go buy some steel case wolf to break in the barrel. Thanks in advance for your advice.
Wouldn't break it in with steel case but I will buy a box of Hornady Black and use that. Reloads are cheaper and should not make a difference. Last two I broke in with load development. Might as well get two things done at once realizing I have to go back and verify... Course that means I have to shoot some more...
So I can do load development and break in the barrel at the same time. This is the answer I was looking for. Start at the bottom, work my way up, and follow the standard break-in process. Thank you.
06-14-2020, 09:55 PM (This post was last modified: 06-14-2020, 09:57 PM by Klem.)
The only 'breaking' a barrel needs is to be properly fouled with copper and I imagine that occurs in the first few rounds. A quality barrel will not be a cheese grater so may only take four or five to be sure. It doesn't take a hot load to fill the micro-pores with copper. Factory loads can be hot. If you are hand-loader why not load 10 loads 10% below SAAMI.
I shoot the first round through every new barrel from the hip while looking away (for safety) and then shoot as normal after that.
Klem Wrote:The only 'breaking' a barrel needs is to be properly fouled with copper and I imagine that occurs in the first few rounds. A quality barrel will not be a cheese grater so may only take four or five to be sure. It doesn't take a hot load to fill the micro-pores with copper.
I shoot the first round through every new barrel from the hip while looking away (for safety) and then shoot as normal after that.
Yep. My 6.5 Grendel Bartlein barrel was broke in upon zeroing.5 shots.
So folks must think that the following recommended barrel break-in for Criterion barrels is a waste of time then?
Quote:Why should I break-in my barrel?
The purpose of a barrel break-in procedure is to limit buildup of copper fouling. An excess of copper fouling can serve to increase chamber pressures, reduce velocity, negatively impact bullet stability, and decrease barrel performance.
What causes copper fouling?
Reamer rings and poor finish may cause significant levels of copper fouling. While all barrels may experience some degree of fouling, the amount left behind will vary by manufacturer and barrel model.
What helpful tips can you provide regarding the break-in process?
Some helpful points to consider are listed below:
A bore guide, coated rod, and brass jag should be used throughout the break-in process.
Bore guides are especially important when breaking in rifles that are cleaned from the muzzle.
A damaged crown can cause a catastrophic decline in performance, and should be avoided at all costs.
Bore brushes are unnecessary, and tend to provide false coloration by removing copper residue from the brush itself.
Keep patches centered on the jag when running them down the barrel. Off-centered patches may cause the jag to run down the side of the bore, damaging the finish.
Be sure to read the instructions listed on the package of your bore cleaner. Some compounds will list different application requirements that need to be followed in order to prevent damage to the barrel.
Some corrosive solvents should be not be left sitting in the barrel for an extended period of time, and may eventually eat into the finish of the barrel itself.
Solvents may occasionally lose effectiveness after repeated use, and will require the subsequent use of another compound to regain their ability to remove any remaining copper fouling.
What process can I use to break-in my barrel?
With the goal of gradually reducing copper fouling, we suggest beginning the break-in process with single shot groups. After each group the shooter should clean the barrel with a copper solvent. When fouling begins to diminish after each shot, group sizes can be subsequently increased to five rounds. When fouling is reduced after each five round group, the group size can be increased to ten rounds. If the barrel has no copper fouling after a ten round group, your rifle is ready for your next match.
The removal of copper fouling is important, but the most important factor in barrel maintenance is the removal of all moisture. Trapped water will wreak havoc on barrel performance, so make sure to run a few patches through after each use to ensure no condensation remains on the rifling.
I used to go through the ritual of barrel break-in, believing it would help with accuracy and reduce copper fouling. I now fire 3 to five rounds to zero, clean once and then start my normal cleaning interval. Ive found that a quality barrel chambered with good tooling will shoot and clean up fine, without needing to through ordeal of break-in. Heres an opinion from someone that knew a thing or two about barrels:
How to Break-in a Barrel
-- A Dissenting Point of View
Gale McMillan, of McMillan Stocks fame, was one of the finest barrel-makers and benchrest shooters of all time. Here he argues that elaborate barrel break-in procedures do more harm than good.
Comments collected from Gale's Gun Forum postings.
As a barrel maker I have looked in thousands of new and used barrels with a bore scope and I will tell you that if every one followed the prescribed [one shot, one clean] break-in method, a very large number would do more harm than good. The reason you hear of the gain in accuracy is because if you chamber a barrel with a reamer that has a dull throater instead of cutting clean sharp rifling it smears a burr up on the down wind side of the rifling. It takes from one to two hundred rounds to burn this burr out and the rifle to settle down and shoot its best. Anyone who chambers rifle barrels has tolerances on how dull to let the reamer get and factories let them go longer than any competent smith would.
Another tidbit to consider--take a 300 Win Mag that has a life expectancy of 1000 rounds. Use 10% of it up with your break-in procedure. For every 10 barrels the barrel-maker makes he has to make one more just to take care of the break-in. No wonder barrel-makers like to see this. Now when you flame me on this please [explain] what you think is happening to the inside of your barrel during the break in that is helping you.
Consider this: every round shot in breaking-in a barrel is one round off the life of said rifle barrel. No one has ever told me the physical reason of what happens during break-in firing. In other words what, to the number of pounds of powder shot at any given pressure, is the life of the barrel. No one has ever explained what is being accomplished by shooting and cleaning in any prescribed method. Start your barrel off with 5 rounds and clean it thoroughly and do it again. Nev Maden, a friend down under that my brother taught to make barrels was the one who came up with the [one shot one clean] break-in method. He may think he has come upon something, or he has come up with another way to sell barrels. I feel that the first shot out of a barrel is its best and every one after that deteriorates [the bore] until the barrel is gone. If some one can explain what physically takes place during break-in to modify the barrel then I may change my mind. As the physical properties of a barrel don't change because of the break-in procedures it means it's all hog wash. I am open to any suggestions that can be documented otherwise if it is just someone's opinion--forget it.
It all got started when a barrel maker that I know started putting break-in instructions in the box with each barrel he shipped a few years ago. I asked him how he figured it would help and his reply was if they shoot 100 rounds breaking in this barrel that's total life is 3000 rounds and I make 1000 barrels a year just figure how many more barrels I will get to make. He had a point; it definitely will shorten the barrel life. I have been a barrel maker a fair amount of time and my barrels have set and reset benchrest world records so many times I quit keeping track (at one time they held 7 at one time) along with High Power, Silhouette, Smallbore national and world records and my instructions were to clean as often as possible preferably every 10 rounds. I inspect every barrel taken off and every new barrel before it is shipped with a bore scope and I will tell you all that I see far more barrels ruined by cleaning rods than I see worn out from normal wear and tear. I am even reading about people recommending breaking-in pistols. As if it will help their shooting ability or the guns'.
I don't do a break in at all. I think it's pure hogwash.
Non of the rifles/barrels I have now had a break in done and all of them shoot sub moa. Only one of those barrels is a custom made barrel the rest are rack grade.
Only thing I do is shoot about 200 rounds of factory ammo to get the rifle functioning and some base velocity's.
After that I don't clean the bore till the groups start to open up, that normally takes a few hundred rounds for that to happen.
Klem Wrote:The only 'breaking' a barrel needs is to be properly fouled with copper and I imagine that occurs in the first few rounds. A quality barrel will not be a cheese grater so may only take four or five to be sure. It doesn't take a hot load to fill the micro-pores with copper. Factory loads can be hot. If you are hand-loader why not load 10 loads 10% below SAAMI.
I shoot the first round through every new barrel from the hip while looking away (for safety) and then shoot as normal after that.
Thank you all for the info. I enjoyed the spirited discussion on barrel break in. I am going to really like this community. I think I will just work up a 5 shot ladder clean the barrel and then reconfirm the data with another 5 shot ladder. I will be shooting the first from the hip. ????
Crunchy Taco Wrote:Thank you all for the info. I enjoyed the spirited discussion on barrel break in. I am going to really like this community. I think I will just work up a 5 shot ladder clean the barrel and then reconfirm the data with another 5 shot ladder. I will be shooting the first from the hip. ????
Depending on the barrel it may take a 100 to 150 rounds for it to settle in. Premium barrels tend to shoot well right out the gate if it's a good one.
06-15-2020, 03:06 AM (This post was last modified: 06-15-2020, 03:21 AM by Klem.)
One more thing...Tubb's FinalFinish bullets is the scariest waste of money I've seen in a long time. No doubt David is a good shot and brings credibility, on his way to the bank...
A piece of kit I've been drooling over for years is the Patriot Ordinance Roller Cam Pin. I mean, it's shiny and looks so special. Even though BCG's work perfectly well without it this one is a must have... https://www.rainierarms.com/pof-223-roller-cam-pin/
Agreed on barrel dependency, for example, Lilja shot well quickly, Savage 5R is still needing attention after following recommended break in and over 50 handloads (more railroad tracks than a train yard),
Depending on the discipline you're shooting, barrel break-in may or may not be relevant to your interests.
For most shooting disciplines, it is not relevant. For the Bench Rest crowd, it might be worth it and guys that shoot that discipline seem to follow specific break-in procedures.
For hunters, recreational target shooters, and even many competitors, I'm not sure what practical benefits you will see unless you have a really ragged throat.
I personally order barrels specific to what I'm, and just shoot them.
I have yet to own and shoot a barrel that does not meet the expectations I was looking for, given the price I paid for it.
If it's a low-price point AR15 barrel meant for blasting, I'd be wasting my time doing barrel break-in.
For the high-end barrels from Krieger, Bartlein, Lilja, or Criterion, they just shoot out-of-the-gate with any of the factory loads as a rule, so I just don't gain a practical benefit in doing the hoola-hoop dance with break-in.
Those more expensive initial investment barrels normally will consistently group anywhere from 1/3-3/4 MOA 5rd groups even from AR15s. Some have shot better with cheaper factory ammo compared with certain samples of more costly factory ammo as well. Some have put 8 rounds or more into an indistinguishable hole at 100yds (PF Bartlein 20" with PF loaded 123gr SMK).
It's my experience that a good barrel, properly-chambered, with concentric threads and square shoulders, mounted solidly to the upper, will shoot most of the loads you put through them into sub-MOA groups consistently. Finding hand loads that shoot through them is very easy, with multiple nodes presenting themselves on a single range session.
As the price point in the barrel goes down, you should expect the group size to go up and not wonder why. Considering how things used to be several decades ago, most shooters don't realize how good they have it nowadays being able to shoot 1.5 MOA with semi-automatic rifles with $150-$250 barrels.
NRA Basic, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, RSO
CCW, CQM, DM, Long Range Rifle Instructor
6.5 Grendel Reloading Handbooks & chamber brushes can be found here:
