G&A Article on New 6.5 Army Round

[hill37]

Glanced at Article in Guns and Ammo Magazine at the Walmart library. Author did not like it much. Too long for AR15 and not much more power than the Grendel.

[A5BLASTER]

Wait new 6.5 military round? What happened to the 6.8 super duper ultra mini mag thing amobob round they was talking about last month?

[n9nwo]

The Army seems to be experimenting with a number of rounds.

The .300 PRC seems to be hot
https://www.gunsandammo.com/editorial/ho...nse/329558

And a review of the .300 PRC
https://www.gunsandammo.com/editorial/re...prc/358208


Also an article on the various 6.5mm cartridges
https://www.gunsandammo.com/editorial/re...prc/358208

[Randy99CL]

It's been said many times before but why can't the military just grab what's already fully developed, proven, already in production and cheap?

[LR1955]

It's been said many times before but why can't the military just grab what's already fully developed, proven, already in production and cheap?

Randy:

In many cases they do but when it comes to ammunition they don't and for very good reasons. The ammunition must not only meet a requirement but also be completely functional in all environmental conditions.

Tell me how well the Grendel works in -20F and + 120 F temps using the same powder, powder charge, primer, and brass and if the load will meet what ever the ballistic requirements may be. Would also like to see ten service grade Grendel carbines shooting this load go for 10K rounds each without shearing bolt lugs.

There will be nothing cheap about a new round of ball ammunition given all the requirements of the battlefield of today. And, there is not a single private company capable of producing the amount of ammunition our military needs.

LR55

[hill37]

What would be the extra cost of a Aermet bolt and WOA extension. Or even a new bolt and extension design.

[stanc]

It's been said many times before but why can't the military just grab what's already fully developed, proven, already in production and cheap?

If you're referring to 6.5 Grendel, it is far from being fully developed, proven, and already in production.

There are no 6.5 Grendel machine guns in production, and AFAIK, there are none even in development.

There are no disintegrating links available, which would be necessary to feed a 6.5 Grendel machine gun.


There are no 6.5 Grendel stripper clips available.


There is no 6.5 Grendel EPR ammo on the market.


There is no 6.5 Grendel Tracer ammo available.


Almost everything that would be required to field a 6.5 Grendel weapon system still needs to be developed.

[n9nwo]

The way some in the military are thinking a MG might not be desired. Rather go like the Marines with an Automatic Rifle being fed by magazines.

There seems to be a lot of confusing information out there. Some talk of just going back to the 6.5 Creedmoor (longer case). Others are talking of either 6.5x45 or 6.8x43. I am not sure that the powers that be even know.

Now the special ops guys are messing with .300 PRC

[stanc]

The way some in the military are thinking a MG might not be desired. Rather go like the Marines with an Automatic Rifle being fed by magazines.

Yes, there are some in the Army who want to switch from a belt-fed machine gun to an automatic rifle.

But, even that is not now an option, because nobody has yet developed a 6.5 Grendel automatic rifle.

There is also the matter of magazine capacity: 25 rds is little better than the 20 rds of the WWII BAR.

[video=youtube;XltuZNfGdYY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XltuZNfGdYY[/video]

There seems to be a lot of confusing information out there. Some talk of just going back to the 6.5 Creedmoor (longer case). Others are talking of either 6.5x45 or 6.8x43.

SOCOM reportedly is working on a 6.5 Creedmoor machine gun. Talk of 6.5x45 and 6.8x43 is just talk.

[JASmith]

The basic issue does NOT include what one could describe as enablers like disintegrating links.

Rather, the question is more like “Does the new cartridge offer the total performance enhancement in terms of ballistics, logistics, and so on needed to justify the investment needed to create them?”

We have seen enough discussion to conclude that we probably have yet to see the cartridge that does.

[stanc]

The basic issue does NOT include what one could describe as enablers like disintegrating links.

I was addressing the issue raised by Randy99CL in post #4, which DOES include "what one could describe as enablers like disintegrating links," and more.

Rather, the question is more like “Does the new cartridge offer the total performance enhancement in terms of ballistics, logistics, and so on needed to justify the investment needed to create them?”

We have seen enough discussion to conclude that we probably have yet to see the cartridge that does.

Actually, we HAVE seen a cartridge for which the investment needed to create new links was considered justified. It is the middle one in the photo below.



[video=youtube;rG5sY_c_5wo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rG5sY_c_5wo[/video]

[n9nwo]

I see a lot of articles the "new 6.8mm round". Then a lot of talk about history of weapon and cartridge development. No specifications.

[stanc]

I see a lot of articles the "new 6.8mm round". Then a lot of talk about history of weapon and cartridge development. No specifications.

Probably because the 6.8mm cartridge candidates are still in development, and no specs have been released.

[Mattiecutter]

Actually, the Sebian army has debued a 6.5 Grendel made by Zastava. It is called a M17 and is a Ak variant.

[LR1955]

Actually, the Sebian army has debued a 6.5 Grendel made by Zastava. It is called a M17 and is a Ak variant.

MC:

Hmmmmmmm. You don't say? http://www.65grendel.com/forum/showthrea...ht=Serbian

Problem is that no one is quite sure if they did or not.

LR55

[lazyengineer]

MC:

Hmmmmmmm. You don't say? http://www.65grendel.com/forum/showthrea...ht=Serbian

Problem is that no one is quite sure if they did or not.

LR55

As far as I can tell it's more of a curiosity than actually real. A shame really, I think it's just a better round. I don't know if dead, so much as not really moving.

[n9nwo]

Interesting article on the 6.8mm competition. The round has to weight 20% less which means that it would not be a brass case. Polymer of some form.

I still hold that the end result will be about 6.8x45. And, BTW, they have 27 months to make their presentation.

https://www.tactical-life.com/lifestyle/...8mm-round/

[LR1955]

As far as I can tell it's more of a curiosity than actually real. A shame really, I think it's just a better round. I don't know if dead, so much as not really moving.

LE:

Maybe the Serbians tested it and found it did not meet their requirements? Or cost too much? Fact is we don't know.

LR55