Protecting the Second Amendment

[Nukes]

Speaking of evidence, where is the evidence?

Orlando Nightclub Shooting: Questions and Anomalies Surround ‘Worst Mass Shooting in U.S. History’
https://memoryholeblog.com/2016/06/14/or...s-history/

Orlando Shooting — Paul Craig Roberts
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2016/06/...g-roberts/

From the USS Maine through the Lusitania, Pearl Harbor, Gulf of Tonkin incident, Waco, OKC, 9/11, Sandy Hook etc., diabolical monsters lie to us. Once again, their lips are moving. They seek to move their total control agenda forward by any and all means possible.

[LR1955]

OK:

Read both. Both state opinions but no evidence. In fact, that Roberts guy only says that there is a bunch of conflicting reports from witnesses but does not state a conspiracy. Ask any LEA guy who gets multiple witnesses if any two of their stories are absolutely the same in every regard. And Roberts links to some rag in Britain what is akin the the National Enquirer, which does not provide any facts either.

What this type of garbage does is present gun owners as paranoid and dangerous people who should not own guns.

These conspiracies give fodder for leftists to paint gun owners as insane and thus dangerous to society. And such stuff gives them more fodder to condemn the 2A as something that needs to be eliminated.

One conspiracy that is proven is that the left will use any act of violence done by someone with a firearm as a reason to ban all firearms. They will not stop with AR-15's. They want all guns banned. And they could care less if the guy was a Muslim terrorists or a plain old nut job who stole the gun and blasted people. They will whine about it being a terrible crime but otherwise they don't care about anything else except banning all firearms from the citizenry. They have been doing this since the 60's and it is akin to a religion with them now.

So, if you guys want to protect the 2A, you won't succeed by using some really far out conspiracies as evidence or even a game plan.

Give us a game plan to protect the 2A.


LR55

[BjornF16]

Let's start by not blaming guns but go to the heart of the issue here - namely handcuffed law enforcement. FBI had plenty of opportunity to intervene with jihadi omar; they just couldn't act because of the current climate within this administration as it pertains to islamo-fascism. So lets make the following changes:

1. Removing FBI from underneath DOJ political hack purview and make them an independent agency

2. Remove the politically correct prohibitions on investigating islamo-fascist tendencies and nomenclature

3. Reinstate law enforcement and military training on islamo-fascist proliclivities

4. Eliminate gun free zones (in this case, FL has prohibition on guns in establishments that serve alcohol, or at least, make a majority of their profits from alcohol sales; similar to TX 51% Establishment prohibition)

5. Declare CAIR as a terrorist organization


http://www.breitbart.com/national-securi...alization/

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/...ad-sharia/

[montana]

The best game plan is the truth about the second amendment and it's purpose. There is a sickness of stupidity spreading in this nation like the 1918 flu pandemic. The extreme left and now many on the, right will never accept anything but total gun ban's and subjugation to their intellectual superiority and leader ship "vomit". As obama's policy has completely failed, he still miss directs the problem as his little toady's follow along to his drum beat. His administration is a conspiracy. We now have due process, "the back bone of our nation" being put into questioned.http://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/jo...rol-224425
Freaks in girl's bathrooms, muslim terrorist poring across our borders with aide and support by the very people who are suppose to protect our freedoms and safety is an unbelievable conspiracy that is happening before our eyes. The left will always see gun owners as insane and dangerous. It is the people who haven't drank the cool aide that we have to educate about the Second amendment. The insane left and now many on the right should be easy fodder in any debate but the silence from many gun owners and republicans these last seven years makes a person raise their eyebrows. Call and write your Senators and Representatives about the true use of the AR-15 and the Second amendment. None of the Bill of Rights are negotiable. If we hide in our basements not wanting to draw attention to our selves it is already over. Speak up, write letters and don't ever be silent when the second amendment is brought up.

[sneaky one]

Well said, get active ! Do a something.... don't just cringe , and worry. Push ! Call, send letters - non threatening ,,, tell them what you want from the 2nd amend.- It's our given right. Time does not change that, nor the fact that mental health issues need to be dealt with sooner. Govt. needs to spend less on bombs, and more on health here.

We ALL need to get proactive on the strange neighbor- the loner guy ( how many gals have gone on a spree lately, or ever? )- LOOK ,, NOTICE WHAT"S GOING ON AROUND YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Call 5-O, the po po. Have them check things out. Don't be a rat to the neighbor who's dog makes a mistake in your precious yard here - there.

Get your eyes off the TV set ! Notice- report. Talk to your neighbors. We do the( night to unite here, in august each year, at our place or next door family. )

We review what - who- etc., in our small hood in boring northern suburb - 15 mins. north of dtwn. Mpls. I have the most weapons. They all love me... heee !

Some have a couple, I let them know what to do IFSHTFAN... I'm getting them into self protection as I type- many ways to push, protect.

Get outside, or look from windows, don't be paranoid---- Just get really good at noticing details .

This Orlando shooter has had a History since 3rd grade- talkin violence, etc. NO ONE NOTICED ???? These are the triggs to look and listen for... Something is amiss.

Turns out- it's the classic parental response- he was a struggle to deal with..... Really ? Call someone- get some Freaking help ! OMG, over & over ! GET INVOLVED IN JR"S LIFE

Back to mental health issue , over and again..... guns kill us - like a fork............ causes wt. gains... yet the wt. kills us slowly, keep eatin " America.

Autos, man- that's my bidness- they kill lot's every year. I'm trying to save a many ! I helped make cars Stronger, like a Nascar race car.
Is It The Cars' fault that the idiotic owner was drunk- or texting , or just a really beadd driver ?? Who trained them to drive ? Hold them accountable also ! Who issued the license ?

That's the obomber idea- We the people are the problem- it's secondary, behind a piece of metal.- Plastic

I'm thinking of exiting the USA,,,, not too happy here anymore... It's become too far off course for me.. Needs a fix here, who can do that ?

[SHORT-N-SASSY]

[SIZE="3"]"He wants to lump this in with Sandy Hook, Aurora which he mentioned, as if it's some kind of crazy person without a motive who goes ahead and shoots. Now, the problem is that you've got to ask yourself, is Orlando more akin to those, or is it more akin to the Boston Marathon, which he didn't mention. The reason he didn't is because there was no gun involved." --- (http://video.foxnews.com/v/4946616188001...show-clips) (See 02:32 - 03:00).
[/SIZE]

[sneaky one]

I grew up near Canada- maybe they will get me in...

If not- billary will have to build lots of jails to house a many millions inside- We will push back so hard, I'll stop here for now. Gun, what gun ?

OOOpsie, there goes the economy again... think about this in a grand old picture.-.

[Nukes]

...namely handcuffed law enforcement. ...

"Law enforcement" killed more people in 2015 than have been killed in ALL mass murders since Charles Whitman climbed the U Texas tower.

"Our" military has killed millions of non-combatants.

Not including war, 20th century governments killed about ⅓ BILLION of their own citizens, after first disarming them.

Governments (and their minions in government costumes) are the worst mass murderers.... and Bjorn thinks they don't have enough power. Go figure.

[LR1955]

Guys:

I will not tolerate insane ramblings from ultra paranoid people.

Nor will I tolerate anyone insulting our country like Nukes did in his post.

LR55

[dammitman]

i understand that, its non productive to be paranoid. i think that the most damage to our firearm rights will depend on the choice for the supreme court, period. the push by way too many people is to slightly tweak the second ammendment. it needs no tweaking, at all. protecting the second ammendment is gonna rely on the supreme court not messing with it.

[montana]

I guess insane ramblings and being ultra paranoid depends on ones opinion. Having irrational fear of something is a phobia which the left and some on the right use for their political gain. Hoplophobia is a perfect example I exposed with the News day reporter after his first shooting experience with an AR-15, or could it have been a propaganda peace to excite the hoplophob"s to further their political gains to disarm us of modern firearms. The meaning and purpose of the Second Amendment is obvious to any one with a third grade reading ability and the ability to read the Founding Fathers papers on that subject. When some members on the Supreme Court voted the Second Amendment was not an individual right, "especially when it is in the Bill of rights" it is not paranoia to know they wish to dis arm us. If they Constitutionally voted to repeal the Second Amendment I would not agree but would accept it since this is how our country is suppose to work. The opposition knows that they do not have the support to do this so they change the meaning of the Second Amendment, and flood the media with lies an irrational fear which in the end achieves their goals of disarming us. This in it self is a conspiracy. LR1955 you are the moderator of this site so I will respect your decision but I personally will have to respectfully disagree with it.

[LR1955]

I guess insane ramblings and being ultra paranoid depends on ones opinion. Having irrational fear of something is a phobia which the left and some on the right use for their political gain. Hoplophobia is a perfect example I exposed with the News day reporter after his first shooting experience with an AR-15, or could it have been a propaganda peace to excite the hoplophob"s to further their political gains to disarm us of modern firearms. The meaning and purpose of the Second Amendment is obvious to any one with a third grade reading ability and the ability to read the Founding Fathers papers on that subject. When some members on the Supreme Court voted the Second Amendment was not an individual right, "especially when it is in the Bill of rights" it is not paranoia to know they wish to dis arm us. If they Constitutionally voted to repeal the Second Amendment I would not agree but would accept it since this is how our country is suppose to work. The opposition knows that they do not have the support to do this so they change the meaning of the Second Amendment, and flood the media with lies an irrational fear which in the end achieves their goals of disarming us. This in it self is a conspiracy. LR1955 you are the moderator of this site so I will respect your decision but I personally will have to respectfully disagree with it.

Montana:

You obviously didn't read what Nukes said that caused me to ban him. I banned him three times in the past and Bill, once. Overall, he refused to stick to the topic at hand. Of secondary importance is that this is not a forum for his Anarchistic rants. If you agree with what ever it is he is ranting about, so be it. The difference is that you and the other guys here stick to the topic and Nukes couldn't, ever. And when called out, he would respond with more rants.

Sometimes we stray from the topic. Agreed. No one is going to ban someone outright unless they say something that is so outlandish and or insulting that moderators are left with no other choice.

We warned Nukes time and again before each banning so he knew the rules.

So, your plan to save the 2A is?

LR55

[montana]

Montana:

You obviously didn't read what Nukes said that caused me to ban him. I banned him three times in the past and Bill, once. Overall, he refused to stick to the topic at hand. Of secondary importance is that this is not a forum for his Anarchistic rants. If you agree with what ever it is he is ranting about, so be it. The difference is that you and the other guys here stick to the topic and Nukes couldn't, ever. And when called out, he would respond with more rants.

Sometimes we stray from the topic. Agreed. No one is going to ban someone outright unless they say something that is so outlandish and or insulting that moderators are left with no other choice.

We warned Nukes time and again before each banning so he knew the rules.

So, your plan to save the 2A is?

LR55

I think I have covered what our plan should be and I have been fighting this battle since the 70's. It never ends! If you have any other ideas please join in.

[SHORT-N-SASSY]

[SIZE="3"]"Gun-free zones prevent law-abiding citizens from protecting themselves, and create vulnerable populations that are targeted by criminals." --- January 7, 2015 Press Release: U.S. Representative Thomas Massie Proposes Repeal of Federal Gun-Free School Zones Act

Why Terrorists Target Gun-Free Zones (http://nypost.com/2016/06/15/why-terrori...ree-zones/)

Why the Orlando Victims were Defenseless (http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/...eless.html)

I Google'd "Armed customer stops robbery." I was rewarded with pages and pages of incidents, wherein, a good guy/gal with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Here's just one: Armed Customer Stops Holdup at Ocala Internet Cafe (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9RKMtLcacU).
[/SIZE]

[LR1955]

I think I have covered what our plan should be and I have been fighting this battle since the 70's. It never ends! If you have any other ideas please join in.

Montana:

Roger. My plans fall in line with 'JAS'. I am afraid that it is more a traditional NRA approach of writing short messages to elected officials and persuading neutral people to support all of our rights and why they should.

And, like many here, we know that if our representative is anti-gun, like mine, nothing we say will persuade them to change their minds. So, we support candidates who support our Bill of Rights, the way it was written.

No way anyone is going to convince a anti-gunner to change their ways. That only happens if they become a victim of a violent crime where they were unable to defend themselves. So, you got to convince those voters who have no real opinion.

I have always held the belief that if a person had to go through the process required to buy a firearm, their minds would start to change. You see, most believe you can walk into a gun store and come out in a few minutes carrying your brand new M-240B and thousands of rounds of 'cop killer' ammo. So, I ask them to go into a gun shop, look at the prices of the guns and ammo, and then what must be done to buy one. That normally starts them in the right direction.

Gun Clubs can also host open houses where people can see how the 2A is viewed by gun owners, how ranges are run, learn about hunter education, the shooting sports, and the use of firearms for defense. That too is a good way to convince people who are not adamantly opposed to firearms. This one requires some people who have great interpersonal skills and can communicate well enough that those attending won't be stigmatized or intimidated. It is a real good way to shift the views of many people who are not sure.

So, there you go! A couple of grass roots ideas that I think can go a long way.

LR55

[customcutter]

My brother posted on FB last night that we need gun purchasing reforms. Mind you he served 9 years in the Army as an MP, got out and went in the reserves, then was called back up for active duty in Desert Storm and attached to the 82nd Airborne.

I asked him to clarify by what purchasing reforms we needed. He said that any assault rifle capable of firing more than 15 rounds should be restricted even if used for hunting. That a Federal background check should be done, not just local, and people shouldn't be able to walk into a gun show and buy a gun without doing the proper background checks, and that there should be a 3 day waiting period.

I had asked him because he doesn't own a firearm and had therefore never bought one. So I wondered what he thought the requirements were and asked how he could even know, if he had never bought a firearm. I just laughed at how much he stated he knew because he had read the Fl Statutes. I told him that an Assault Rifle is capable of automatic fire, AR-15's are not, Assault Rifles are restricted from purchase by the general public. I didn't even bother with it being illegal to hunt with a magazine capable of holding more than 5 rounds. I told him that at the time of the purchase a form is filled out and called in to the Feds, not the local LE agency. I also told him that is true whether it is purchased at a gun store or a gun show, no exemptions except for private sales. I also told him that in Hillsborough County Fl there is a 3 day waiting period on all firearm sales, unless you have CCW permit.

He finally agreed we don't need more laws, but that we need the laws we have enforced. Hopefully I have brought one out of the darkness...

It's amazing what a 57 year old doesn't know, but takes for granted based on the news they watch....

[SHORT-N-SASSY]

[SIZE="3"]And, a breath of fresh air: Update: Tennessee Legislature Makes Major Moves To Get Rid Of Gun-Free Zones At Public Universities And Businesses (http://crimeresearch.org/2016/04/tenness...usinesses/).
[/SIZE]

[37L1]

This is how they will do it. If Bushmaster/Remington lawsuit is allowed to go forward despite the 2005 law, any firearms maker will be targeted and put out of business.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/06/20/hea...tcmp=hpbt2

[LRRPF52]

SCOTUS just upheld State violations of 2A regarding "assault rifles".

[stanc]

"Gun-free zones prevent law-abiding citizens from protecting themselves, and create vulnerable populations that are targeted by criminals." --- January 7, 2015 Press Release: U.S. Representative Thomas Massie Proposes Repeal of Federal Gun-Free School Zones Act

Why Terrorists Target Gun-Free Zones (http://nypost.com/2016/06/15/why-terrori...ree-zones/)

Why the Orlando Victims were Defenseless (http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/...eless.html)

I Google'd "Armed customer stops robbery." I was rewarded with pages and pages of incidents, wherein, a good guy/gal with a gun stopped a bad guy with a gun. Here's just one: Armed Customer Stops Holdup at Ocala Internet Cafe (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9RKMtLcacU).

Great arguments for concealed carry of handguns.

Unfortunately, doesn't help justify availability of semi-auto assault rifle variants.