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We have never had an accidental shooting in our local shooting club since it was created. In that time our local sheriffs and city police departments have had three accidental shootings with one officer being shot by his instructor. The city police now have to train at our local shooting range because of the lawsuits that followed and prevent them from training on county land. The tax payers had to pay for these mistakes not the individual parties involved . If people would follow the 4 safety firearm rules no accidents would ever occur. Having a license doesn't necessarily mean an individual is going to be any safer than a person with out one. I'm for all the training a person can obtain but in the end it is the individual who is responsible for their actions. Have people with driving licenses prevented drunk driving, road rage, and careless driving? When a constitutional right can only be exercised by the approval of others "people in government" by means of a license "permission" we cease to be free individuals.
Cory, you are absolutely correct about ethanol. I wont even get started on that 
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01-01-2014, 09:40 PM
(This post was last modified: 01-01-2014, 09:43 PM by NugginFutz.)
BjornF16 Wrote:^^^ +1 ^^^
Global warming is nothing more than a hoax meant to control peoples' behavior. Models to predict temperatures don't adequately account for solar cycles, CO2 sinks in the oceans, volcanic activity on sea floors that partially drive el nino, la nina cycles, etc. In short, they don't know what they think they know.
Danish scientists recently discovered previous global temperatures were much warmer than previously thought, and ice/snow was less impacted than previously thought. Undermines the current climate change alarmist propaganda.
Absolutely - no small irony there, is it? Polar ice is increasing, while ice in other regions is decreasing. Makes it too easy to cherry pick local phenomena to support your claim (either side). Bottom line is that the Global Warmers can't explain why the last 15 years have not been warming, as predicted. Somehow, they claim, something has pressed an imaginary "pause" button.
Quote:Just ask the stupid alarmists stuck in the ice in Antarctica...LOL
"But it's OLD ice!!", they say. Well, I guess that says it, then. It hasn't melted.
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montana Wrote:We have never had an accidental shooting in our local shooting club since it was created. In that time our local sheriffs and city police departments have had three accidental shootings with one officer being shot by his instructor. The city police now have to train at our local shooting range because of the lawsuits that followed and prevent them from training on county land. The tax payers had to pay for these mistakes not the individual parties involved . If people would follow the 4 safety firearm rules no accidents would ever occur. Having a license doesn't necessarily mean an individual is going to be any safer than a person with out one. I'm for all the training a person can obtain but in the end it is the individual who is responsible for their actions. Have people with driving licenses prevented drunk driving, road rage, and careless driving? When a constitutional right can only be exercised by the approval of others "people in government" by means of a license "permission" we cease to be free individuals.
Cory, you are absolutely correct about ethanol. I wont even get started on that
+1 Y'all should watch the stossel special on getting a carry permit in NYC. If you don't have political connections you're quite literally out of luck.
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security, deserve neither." Benjamin Franklin
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Carry permits should be right to carry in all states, but there are people who should not get them . Do you guys think that people who have been commeted to a mental hospital should be able to have a gun if they have not been cleared? Remember they can see things that are not there and hear things. God told me to shot them all. No they should not have guns. This includes service members or anyone else with that kind of problem.
Some one with road rage will not have there license for long.
Cory
My 02 TransAm has run fine on 10% ethanol with no problem. What problems did you have? More than 10% will cause problems.
April 2011 had more tornados than any other month on record. Hurricane Sandy in 2012. The 12 warmest years on record have occurred since 1998.
explorecaves
Unregistered
Walter Wrote:Carry permits should be right to carry in all states, but there are people who should not get them . Do you guys think that people who have been commeted to a mental hospital should be able to have a gun if they have not been cleared? Remember they can see things that are not there and hear things. God told me to shot them all. No they should not have guns. This includes service members or anyone else with that kind of problem.
Some one with road rage will not have there license for long.
Cory
My 02 TransAm has run fine on 10% ethanol with no problem. What problems did you have? More than 10% will cause problems.
April 2011 had more tornados than any other month on record. Hurricane Sandy in 2012. The 12 warmest years on record have occurred since 1998.
I will just leave this here…. http://freedomoutpost.com/2013/12/mental...Lo6zv6p.01
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Walter Wrote:Carry permits should be right to carry in all states, but there are people who should not get them . Do you guys think that people who have been commeted to a mental hospital should be able to have a gun if they have not been cleared? Remember they can see things that are not there and hear things. God told me to shot them all. No they should not have guns. This includes service members or anyone else with that kind of problem.
Some one with road rage will not have there license for long.
Cory
My 02 TransAm has run fine on 10% ethanol with no problem. What problems did you have? More than 10% will cause problems.
April 2011 had more tornados than any other month on record. Hurricane Sandy in 2012. The 12 warmest years on record have occurred since 1998.
If they're in a mental hospital they obviously don't have access to firearms. If they've been released under the supervision of a caretaker then yes they shouldn't have access to firearms, but that's the responsibility of the caretaker. If they're now healthy enough to live on their own them why are they not healthy enough to protect themselves?
Piss poor gas mileage to start with that continues to get worse. There's a gunk that builds up in my intake manifold from the ethanol. I've got an idle issue where it idles high when I stop at a light. That's my next problem to track down and fix. I've got a feeling ethanol has damaged a fuel injector.
explorecaves Wrote:I will just leave this here…. http://freedomoutpost.com/2013/12/mental...Lo6zv6p.01
Nice find.
"Those who sacrifice liberty for security, deserve neither." Benjamin Franklin
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01-02-2014, 02:11 AM
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2014, 02:13 AM by Walter.)
What happens when they get out and get off there meds? They go the gun store and get a gun then. "But god told me to shot them all!!!!"
There should be a way to get your rights back. That is a problem.
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Walter Wrote:There should be a way to get your rights back. That is a problem.
I agree with that statement. Including felons as well. You don't stop being a citizen of the USA just because you made one bad choice. If you paid your debt to society then it is paid in FULL. If not then you should still be in jail.
Let's leave the Al Gore movie viewing for another forum gents. This thread was about ATF and how they affect our natural ability to defend ourselves, our families, our neighborhoods, States, and Nation.
Do I need a permit to exercise free speech? How about a permit to go to Church? Do I need a permit to be exempted from providing room and board to soldiers?
How about a permit to be exempt from self-incrimination when accused of a crime? Does anyone here think that I should have to have a permit to write journalist reports, or attend public hearings to report on our representatives in government?
Every single example above that I listed are specifically protected in the Bill of Rights, and are worded as restrictions on Congress from passing any laws to violate the free exercise of these natural and unalienable rights.
The right to keep and bear arms is also one of the rights specifically listed therein, for the necessity of a Free State. The ATF is specifically tasked with enforcing an unconstitutional Federalized registry system of licensed dealers who are permitted, after a hefty fine, to engage in the business of distributing, transferring, and selling firearms.
At a neighborhood level, you could well-regulate like they do in Switzerland, with absolutely no involvement from the clowns in D.C., who literally have no business in worrying about how you and I decide to form our protective posture. Our State Representatives should act as a defensive line in that respect, and many have, but the ATF and DOJ have openly stated that States rights are trumped by the supremacy clause, and they are free to molest us at will, even though they are part of the Executive Branch, which has zero business in interpreting the Law.
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You do need a press pass in some areas which is likened to a permit
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We're going to be reading about these ATF Fast & Furious guns for decades, I'm afraid. The level of callousness and corruption that this case embodies is nothing short of the incredible. The fact that nobody has been held accountable speaks volumes as to Congress. If you watch any of the hearings (I've watched them all since 2011), half of the Congressional Oversight Committee members slavishly defend the DOJ and Eric Holder over this, while accusing the other half of the Committee of being on a racist witch hunt because of Eric Holder's skin color...no really.
Quote:“ATF has accepted responsibility for the mistakes made in the Fast and Furious investigation and at the attorney general's direction we have taken appropriate and decisive action to ensure that these errors will not be repeated,” the bureau said in a statement to CNN.
"And we acknowledge that, regrettably, firearms related to the Fast and Furious investigation will likely continue to be recovered at future crime scenes," it added.
House Oversight Chairman Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) and Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) led the congressional investigation into the program.
Grassley, in a statement to CNN, expressed regret that no one in the administration had yet been held accountable.
“Unfortunately, guns from Fast and Furious will be found in operations like this for years to come," he said. http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-r...-in-mexico
There are way more than 3 victims so far. We're talking scores, if not hundreds. When the beauty queen was gunned down, there were other murder victims who fell beside her. They frequently uncover mass graves in Mexico, many of which have still yet to be discovered. Don't believe me:
Warning: Extremely graphic, not suitable for viewing in company of children or the faint of heart.
Just do a google image search for mass graves in Mexico. I won't post the link.
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Kikn Wrote:You do need a press pass in some areas which is likened to a permit
A press pass is not required to write or speak. It is issued as a credential to an otherwise restricted or limited area, whatever the reason may be. You can still write or speak, even if not allowed into that area.
Many reporters never enter the restricted areas at sporting events, for instance, but still write or report on a game.
You seek escape from pain. We seek the achievement of happiness. You exist for the sake of avoiding punishment. We exist for the sake of earning rewards. Threats will not make us function; fear is not our incentive. It is not death that we wish to avoid, but life that we wish to live. - John Galt
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Although that is true. It is still just another way of keeping the wizard behind the curtain and only allowing certain "approved people" that are really the only ones with a voice the ability to speak out. All the while silencing the others with just a simple piece of paper.
More regulation is more control
Anyway back to your regularly scheduled ATF bashing
I don't look at legitimate criticisms of the ATF and its criminal activities as bashing. Imagine if your family member had been gunned down with a F&F weapon, or your FFL had been revoked based on the false allegations of a field agent and her partner who were vying for limelight and promotions, then seized all your assets and destroyed your livelihood.
Can anyone who thinks that we need Federal gun regulations explain to me the justification behind ATF's existence? It's rhetorical, but when you look at the history of how the frog was boiled, you start to realize that this is agency has zero Constitutional or legal grounds to stand on, but because they were allowed to get away with just a little infringement here, they have occupied the living room.
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