Magneto or Labradar?

[Sticks]

Don't sweat it (you already cost me a fair chunk). I bought my LR not long ago, knowing full well that it would go on sale. I'm down $100.

Somebody please buy my MS!

[Fat Albert]

I have both. Started w/Past 1 . Then to a Chrony, then to a Magneto that I would shot over both to get average between the two. Sold the Chroney for $25 and bought the Labrado. Use both to get average fps but only the Lab for groups. The Mag on the barrel did affect groups. When I bought the Mag and put on the barrel I could see that the weak point is the part that tightens the belt on the barrel. Over tighten and it will come apart. I tightened it on my 6TCU rifle and it would work it way forward with evert shot. When I put it on now I uses a loop of 1" Velcro through the front sling swivel and around the Mag. and it stopped the forward movement. My Labrado will see 6mm bullets out to 90yrds. I uses the Norma online ballistic program to find the short range BC of bullets by working the program backwards. Never found any bullet that had a adj. BC that was as high as the factory said it was. In 1965 I shot over a old school chrono that used two Mylar strip 2" wide and 18" long with a zigzag of copper printed on it that were held by electrical clips. The clips used electrical wires that went to a box that had about 100 lights on it. The strips were about 1 1/2 feet apart and you had to break both zigzag with one shot to get a reading. If you got a reading, different combinations of lights would come on and then you looked into a book that told the FPS for that combination. PS: If you uses the Norma program you have to list the BC with 0. then the BC.

[The Profit Joseph Sith]

Man thats pretty crazy that thing must have cost some coin back in those days. I just wish they invested more in their current processors and higher sampling rates. I for one would pay more. Even more than the already kinda crazy prices. $456 wasnt too terrible though.

I need to get me a job though blew through about $1700 this weekend sitting around gun shopping.. Starting to question my sanity! Lol.

[StoneHendge]

Didn't want to flog this with a new thread.

FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO HAVE HAD BOTH, if you woke up one morning and found that:

- you had neither,
- neither was available on sale
- a Magneto sporter doesn't cut it because you have a few rifles with very long barrel shrouds and your sick of letting the fact that you have a sporter come into your decision making process when purchasing barrel shrouds
- you need a solution for rifle velocity and a) you don't have any pistols, b) you don't care about pistol velocity or c) have a theoretical solution that is better than Magneto or LabRadar but is only applicable for pistols, and
- you don't have a need to answer LabRadar to internally justify the extra expense

Which would you buy? A V3 or LabRadar.

My truck was broken into about a week and a half ago during a town theft rampage and my Sporter was stolen. Though I might get it back today but I didn't. Luckily this was recovered and enabled the local "detectives" to file charges against one of the suspects

[ATTACH=CONFIG]12271[/ATTACH]

I'll note that I got mine BEFORE Heisenberg got his. And I don't need to know its velocity other than that its certainly enough.

[grayfox]

Wow. too many variables in that IF question for me...!
I don't really like shrouds that are too long, and all of my barrels would fit for the MS or the LR just fine.

Since I don't care about getting the group right while MV testing (in my system, more steps need to be done after the MV determination before my grouping is settled upon), honestly either one would work for me fine. Since I already have the MS and am trying to shepherd my shekels, well the LR will have to wait for another day.

If I were starting from scratch and had the budget I reckon I might go for the LR, looks less disruptive overall at the range bench. After all radar was what I started with in the Nav!!! (Back when there were vacuum tubes in the gear!!)

[mdewitt71]

I sold my Magneto V3 once I got the LabRadar.... I still have a Pro Chrono Digital, a Caldwell, and a Alphamaster but, I use them for Archery and pellet guns mainly.
My LabRadar is the favorite and I def would buy it again all over.
Dont care much for the app. I dont usually have my phone out when I am shooting and the screen on the LabRadar unit is just as easy to read as the phone. Now, it I could print from the app that would be cool.
The Magneto is OK but, I hate having to mess with the bayonet and it does change POI for sure on my rifles. I love shooting groups and ladder tests with the LabRadar.
We use em in the Army Sniper and Markmanship units and I have seem many of me get DX'd cuz someone shot em.

[bj139]

Once I figured out the Labradar must be near the muzzle to detect the blast it has detected every shot.
It is certainly easier to use than my original chrony.
I like the phone app since I don't have to lean over the bench to arm or disarm the radar or to start a new string.
I don't have any experience with the Magnetospeed.

[Sticks]

I used my LR yesterday for my load testing. Once I got it taking suppressed shots, then the Bluetooth option was a godsend. Write down my string details and start a new string. I did loose one string that was a puck up the butt. Those Nosler RDFs are cursed. 10 rounds, each a different charge weight and it only captured 1. Getting a microphone. I should also learn to use the doppler trigger.

Learning curve.

[bj139]

Sticks,
Are you getting it out near the muzzle? Once I did this, no more problems.
The LR is now hanging over the front of the bench, where the muzzle is.

[Klem]

BJ,

That looks a fair distance from the gun. I have mine almost touching the legs of the front rest at 6-inches to the side of the middle of the barrel (i.e. back, behind the muzzle). It's less affected by muzzle devices that way.

With suppressed, mine only detects on doppler mode.

[Sticks]

With the brake on, I was about 10" behind the muzzle - mid barrel - and 10" to the side.

Suppressed I had to be about at the muzzle and 6" off the first time and it caught every one. Second round (switched from a 20" braked to the 30" OAL with a can) and could not get the shots. I thought I had it in the same place, but clearly not.

They (Labradar)sell a mic for airguns for $50. I can pickup a lapel mike (looks to be the same size) for $13. I am going to try that presuming the plug is the same. I also need to learn the doppler settings and find out where it picks up the MV so I can correctly input that distance into my ballistics program.

[Triticum]

I've had good luck picking up suppressed shots with mine if I place it about 3" to the side and 3" in front of the end of the can. Took me a while to get the right spot dialed in, but it I put the LR there I pick up every shot.

[bj139]

I like long barrels simply because they are quieter than short. So less hearing damage while hunting.

Klem,
The wide angle camera makes it look farther away. It is about a foot away.
I couldn't get it this far forward without the extension without it falling off the front of the bench.

[Sticks]

Putting these in front of the muzzle is begging for the unshootable LabRadar to get shot.

[bj139]

Putting these in front of the muzzle is begging for the unshootable LabRadar to get shot.

I have thought about this. Why wouldn't the LR block the view of the target through the scope if it was about to be shot?

[grayfox]

I have thought about this. Why wouldn't the LR block the view of the target through the scope if it was about to be shot?

Wait... you're expecting the guy who would put it right in front of the barrel, to actually look thru the scope before he shoots??? :p

[Triticum]

Putting these in front of the muzzle is begging for the unshootable LabRadar to get shot.

Where it have it positioned its still several inches to the side of the muzzle and only 2-3" in front of it. While it wouldn't be impossible to shoot the thing, you would have to be really careless/unobservant for it to happen. To me its an acceptable risk to get the LabRadar to function well when using a can.

[FRB6.5]

IMO the biggest factor in getting a LabRadar to pick up accurately is alignment to the target. The factory notch kind of sucks. I glued a 1" section of a child's sized carbon fiber arrow shaft to mine to act as an aiming aperture.

My friend who turned me on to these did the same to his and is able to pick up suppressed shots without the microphone or Doppler mode.

[Taz575]

I used a small 3/32" diameter or so roll pin taped to the notch to aim mine. Much better than the notch!

[Kswhitetails]

So, as of today, I've had what I believe to be enough time to garner a fair bit of experience with my LabRadar to leave you all with a review. I'm no expert, and not really going to try to make you decide that I'm the reason you want to get or not get your own. These are just my impressions, from the last year of shooting loads for a Grendel, Creedmoor, 9mm, .45, and a short session with a bow. I'm completely happy with my purchase. It's been a challenge at times, but that has been part of the fun. The first time out was a smidge frustrating, but when I broke down and spent 5m with the manual and actually did what it said, WOW, I've been happy since.

The only real draw back I can think of is that you absolutely cannot get reliable readings if used indoors. This is an outside/unobstructed/LOS system that uses a radar "beam" to track your projectile in flight. If you're the kind to do your load development indoors, skip the LR altogether.

The second think I'd call a minor chink in the LR armor, is the complexity of the controls on the unit. It will require some time on the bench for anyone to get into the menu, and test the settings enough to familiarize yourself with it's full potential.

The third issue would be for those of you who shoot suppressed. You're going to want the trigger mic. Or, like myself, have access to a private range where you can get space between you and the next shooter. I'll cover this further later.

Aside from these circumstances, I've yet to be hindered in any way from getting the data I was after using the LR. I've used it next to other shooters, and never had issues with picking up their shots, or their shooting interrupting my session by causing interference with the LR. I have found that I can be hampered when someone is shooting above me off the overhead deck and shooting through my beam, if we break the shots very close together. Side to side was that I can remember, a non issue - when I had it aimed properly. (I use a 1.2" long piece of brass 3/16" tubing taped/silicone-d to the notch in the top as my aiming assist. Very helpful here. Before I bought it, I assumed it'd give me more issues than I recall it having done.

I bought the LR base and the LR unit together, from Midway. I believe they had a sale at something like 460, and including the base and tax/shipping was in for around $530ish. I use an external battery, though the 8 AAs work just fine. Keep in mind that the AAs run down much quicker, I found about half way through the third session using them that I started having issues getting data, and that went away completely when I plugged in the external. This was in the summertime, so it was warm, and I'd say I got maybe 3 1/2 hours good use out of the AAs. I don't let mine sit transmitting for long though, so I'd say less than that - probably considerably - with the disposable batteries. If you go with a LR, invest in a good 20MaH external pack. It's worth it just to charge it up, and throw it in your chrono bag with a cord and never worry about it. Skip the LabRadar base. Buy a tripod, with a ball head, (amazon has some versions that will work well for less than 40 bucks.) If you want a base, make a base by removing the ball head from the tripod and drilling a hole for the appropriate bolt in a 1/2 inch poplar board and sticking some bolts in the corners as feet. Also, a friend of mine here in Wichita makes a thing he calls the "quad pod" which is like a four legged tripod head that uses standard 1" EMT (electrical conduit metal) tubing. Cut a 10' piece from Home Depot or the like into four equal sections of 2.5' and stand it up on your bench. Then, shoot UNDER the LR. It's almost fool proof, (especially suppressed) and you're going to like this setup better anyway for rifle. (If you're interested PM/email for a contact. He also does AMAZING Cerakote work, and has for a long time. If you're thinking of any coating work, I'd throw you his way.)

About shooting suppressed: There is a setting that allows you to track your shots by turning on the radar beam, then shooting through it. The LR then records anything that it tracks along the beam as a shot. This way, you can shoot with your can and get shots without a hitch. This is however an issue on a crowded range, because it's constantly looking for the next bullet rather than beaming only a few ms after your shot. I've had to purchase the suppressor mic just in case, and it works to fire the beam with your shot which the standard mic often will miss. If you're shooting suppressed, get the mic, and it's a non issue. I taped some velcro on the side, and just velcro the mic to the LR itself. The Bracket takes too much time to set up for a quick session, and is unnecessary. Here's the item - (not endorsing MW get it where you find it cheapest...) https://ads.midwayusa.com/product/1017357623?pid=600474

Things I love about it.

It tracks and shows all the data you're ever going to need while developing your loads on one screen, all at the same time. I keep track of weather data, and then write my data for the load under that in my logbook. These numbers, nothing more:
Untitled by ., on Flickr

A laptop bag or backpack are the perfect cases, they're cheap and available everwhere (mine came from goodwill folks, for 3 bucks too) and make great portability tools. I use a backpack and used paracord to tie my tripod on the side. It's a one stop chrono drop once I'm at the bench.

Setup is quick, and once you get the hang of where to put it session to session, it's usable every time you shoot. I take it to the range no matter what I'm planning on doing.

You can use it prone, benchtop, barricade, standing. You can use it to track Pistol, rifle, shotgun, bow, pellet gun, bb gun, your nephews RedRider, and your son's pitching arm. Well, maybe not the pitching arm, but you get the gist. You can use the SD card slot to store your shot string files. This is really nice. All my data is stored on one, and I can refer back to my logs to find old load performance data. Yes, there's an APP for that. (I don't use the app personally, so I can't comment on it...)

Overall, you can't use it inside; You have to familiarize yourself with the controls; You want to get a ball-head tripod, an external battery, and a case of some sort. If you shoot suppressed, the mic will really help, unless you shoot privately.

When this one quits, I'll get another.