Grendel LMG

[stanc]

Surprise! We don't need or want to equal or better the 7.62X51 bullet for bullet.

I said nothing about doing better than 7.62x51. However, equal is desirable, and "close enough" is essential.

But, I do think you are mistaken about the "bullet for bullet" part. If each bullet type (Ball, Tracer, AP, Sniper, etc) doesn't give performance comparable to those of 7.62x54R/7.62x51, then the V4 militaries are unlikely to go for the idea.

If steel-cored 6.5 bullets from the Grendel can equal or better both the M80 and M855A1 performance, then we have a case.

Unless you have credible information that the V4 plan to use M855A1, its performance would seem to be irrelevant.

The pertinent round to compare against is Russian 7.62x54R.

We are very sure that the lead-core FMJ won't get through the plates as well as the M80, or we would likely have already seen pictures of the event.

Illogical conclusion. For one thing, nobody can photograph an event that hasn't happened. For another, until somebody actually shoots steel plates, cinder blocks, etc, with 6.5 FMJ, we can't know how it fares in that regard.

Let's look for testing that will build a case. Do it privately so that that case can be properly articulated with the right people. The testing will still not be viewed as credible because it won't be official, but it gets our foot in the door.

The "foot in the door" part is something I've argued all along. Glad to see you're finally coming around.

But at present, building a case to present to "the right people" is both unnecessary and premature. That can and should wait until optimized 6.5 bullets have been designed and fully developed.

What we need right now is to build a data base so that we can make decisions based on factual information, not beliefs or wishful thinking.