How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved?
#48
stanc Wrote:In theory, I agree. But, I'd sure like to see some comparison testing done to find out if theory translates to reality. Say, perhaps have a number of shooters with varied skill levels, run through different scenarios alternately with a 5.56 M4, a 6.5 Tac 14.5, and a 6.5 Tac 16.

I've done this with my BIL to a degree. The first time shooting my 16" Grendel, he cleaned my poppers at 300m, went to 400m and hit everything 1st-round, then made a 1st-round hit at 500m on a steel IPSC target, with the impact dead center for windage.

He used the drop chart I had generated for it with Brian Litz's Berger Ballistics program, and me on the spotting scope giving him his wind calls, since we literally had a 20mph full value wind. Without my wind calls, he wouldn't have made 1st-round hits.

The main factor missing is training and experience, although a 6.5 Grendel will allow entry-level soldiers to miss closer than they would with a 5.56 NATO carbine, and close misses translate to more effective fire on the enemy to a degree. What really needs to change is the rifle marksmanship programs for professional armies, even if it only means running an intermediate rifle marksmanship course for combat arms personnel before they deploy.

Such a course would involve a lot of time dedicated to teaching external ballistics, use of optics, wind-reading, and range time putting rounds out from 100-600m+ with increased 1st-round hit probability. Only a free-floated system with consistently accurate ammo will really do that, like the SPR, DMR, M4A1 SOPMOD Block II, etc. using 77gr Mk.262 for the 5.56 NATO guns. We're basically talking about a Designated Marksmen course, which would be very difficult to run for every Rifleman in an Infantry battalion, let alone Brigade. It's just not feasible really for everyone, when you look at the range usage, ammunition, instructor experience pool, and weapon requirements.

It is a viable program with 1 out of 4 screened, selected, and trained for a minimum 5-day DM course, and many units have been doing something along these lines, as the DM is now a TO&E position in the US and many coalition nation armies, but still in the growing stages.
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Messages In This Thread
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 02-13-2013, 05:55 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 02-13-2013, 11:42 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-14-2013, 03:17 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bill Alexander - 02-14-2013, 04:41 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-15-2013, 02:40 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-15-2013, 09:58 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 02-16-2013, 06:06 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-16-2013, 07:16 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-16-2013, 07:24 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 02-18-2013, 11:00 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-19-2013, 12:13 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 02-19-2013, 12:55 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 02-19-2013, 01:33 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 02-19-2013, 01:44 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 02-19-2013, 01:56 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-19-2013, 05:24 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 02-19-2013, 07:14 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 02-19-2013, 07:23 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-20-2013, 05:46 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 02-20-2013, 11:04 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 02-21-2013, 09:57 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-22-2013, 07:39 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 02-22-2013, 05:19 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-22-2013, 06:36 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 02-22-2013, 09:10 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-23-2013, 08:25 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-24-2013, 06:44 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Tony Williams - 02-26-2013, 04:46 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 02-27-2013, 12:18 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Tony Williams - 02-27-2013, 07:40 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-01-2013, 11:10 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-01-2013, 11:20 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-02-2013, 03:58 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-02-2013, 05:21 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-02-2013, 08:00 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-02-2013, 08:38 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-02-2013, 09:20 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-02-2013, 09:44 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-02-2013, 10:02 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 03-03-2013, 01:39 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-03-2013, 02:10 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by adrenaline junkie - 03-03-2013, 03:48 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by ricsmall - 03-03-2013, 04:42 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by adrenaline junkie - 03-03-2013, 04:44 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 03-03-2013, 05:13 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bill Alexander - 03-03-2013, 12:14 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-03-2013, 11:41 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-04-2013, 12:15 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-04-2013, 12:38 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bill Alexander - 03-04-2013, 12:49 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 03-04-2013, 04:15 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-04-2013, 03:05 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-04-2013, 03:24 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-04-2013, 03:51 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bill Alexander - 03-04-2013, 08:14 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-04-2013, 11:37 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 03-05-2013, 03:43 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Tony Williams - 03-05-2013, 08:03 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 03-05-2013, 06:10 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bill Alexander - 03-05-2013, 06:32 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-05-2013, 08:20 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Howitzer - 03-05-2013, 08:46 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 03-06-2013, 11:28 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Tony Williams - 03-07-2013, 04:21 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-07-2013, 04:46 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 03-07-2013, 05:05 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Guardsman26 - 03-07-2013, 05:20 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-07-2013, 07:15 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-02-2013, 04:54 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Trooper - 07-02-2013, 06:46 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-03-2013, 01:38 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-03-2013, 01:40 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Tony Williams - 07-04-2013, 03:12 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bigfoot - 07-04-2013, 06:33 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-04-2013, 02:11 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by noone - 07-07-2013, 10:24 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-07-2013, 11:17 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-08-2013, 01:03 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-08-2013, 01:59 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-08-2013, 03:29 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-08-2013, 04:15 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-08-2013, 06:53 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by XcountryRider - 07-13-2013, 04:10 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-14-2013, 12:21 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by XcountryRider - 07-14-2013, 04:47 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by kamrr4437 - 07-14-2013, 10:07 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by kamrr4437 - 07-21-2013, 02:19 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Tony Williams - 07-21-2013, 06:48 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 07-21-2013, 11:34 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Tony Williams - 07-22-2013, 07:45 AM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 07-22-2013, 04:36 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-22-2013, 08:38 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 07-22-2013, 09:33 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by LRRPF52 - 07-22-2013, 10:13 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-23-2013, 01:30 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-23-2013, 05:49 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by woohoo - 07-23-2013, 06:38 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by JASmith - 03-05-2013, 11:16 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bill Alexander - 03-05-2013, 11:19 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bill Alexander - 03-05-2013, 11:25 PM
How could or should the 6.5 mm Grendel be improved? - by Bill Alexander - 03-05-2013, 11:31 PM

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