10-23-2021, 12:10 PM
(This post was last modified: 10-25-2021, 03:15 PM by Oso Polaris.)
Brazz04 Wrote:I've still not figured out this cartridge or why someone would want it. It runs the same speed as a grendel (or granted maybe even 100fps faster for the same bullet). But the bullet you are shooting from is has half the BC. The BC is so bad, the grendel catches it in energy at 100 yards (if you start the HAM'R at 2500fps vs grendel at 2400fps assuming a 16" barrel).
And I hate the argument that it uses all the same components as a standard 5.56. Are you really building a bunch of 5.56 uppers that aren't complete with a BCG and just swapping a single BCG between them? With a gendel or SPC or any other you only have to buy magazines (if you can't afford two magazines, should you be into shooting sports?). BCG's are part of the upper that you're buying anyway, so that's not any kind of extra cost.
For bullet weight, is someone really going to load a 150gr bullet all the way down to 2250fps and going to take elk with that? Anything can be done, but that is living right on the edge of not enough rifle. For hunting deer under 300 yards, it's just fine as a cartridge, it just seems like there are better options that beat it in nearly every category with almost no trade offs.
The attraction of the 6.5 Grendel is the combination of several key attributes... the Trifecta:
1) Power - largest case capacity in AR15 platform.
2) Accuracy
3) Long Range Potential - high BC bullet coupled with heavier bullets allows it to be a 800-100 yard gun.
But lets be honest... the vast majority of rifles, including Grendels, never get shot beyond 100 yards at the range or in the woods. Members of this forum are not a representative cross-section of the shooting populace, most of who simply buy a box of ammo off the store shelf and that it. With this in mind, 300 yards is the outer limit that the average Joe will ever shoot anything at the range or hunting. The Grendel and the HAM'R now look very similar...
Based on observations of fellow shooters, most people start with an entry-level AR15 (5.56) and then 1-2 years later buy a second AR15 (upgrade), and then maybe buy a AR pistol, and then start adding additional AR's in different calibers either by buying entire rifles or different dedicated uppers. I am guessing that the majority (+90%) of AR15s sold are chambered in .223/5.56 so the "simply swapping out a barrel" is a legitimate argument, because it has the lowest threshold level to overcome. The 300 HAMR is straightforward. There is no confusion for inexperienced shooter to get their mind around "Type 1" or "Type II" bolts and chamber matching and the stories and warning ... this just is an added layer of confusion and complexity that results in buyer uncertainty about the Grendel. With the 300 HAMR there are no concerns or cost associated with new type of magazine (2x price of a PMag) or the need and additional cost ($200-$300) for a new Grendel BCG. Remember we are talking about the average Joe, not an enthusiast, so these things add up quickly... the risk of stepping out on a limb with a cartridge that none of your friends or family have ever seen or used is significant and the additional cost is tangible. I take one of my least favorite AR15's and spend $250 on a drop-in barrel and I can now go join a new forum as a card carrying member... oh wait 300 HAMR doesn't have a forum, yet.
The BS around the Alexander Arm's business model/marketing strategy for 6.5 Grendel (first 10 years after its introduction) adversely impacted the ability to find Grendel ammunition or buy aftermarket rifle components...it really hurt the cartridges introduction and acceptance. This fumble allowed the 300 Blackout too become the second most successful cartridge for the AR15 behind the .223/5.56. On any given day, more targets are shot with and more game are killed with a 300BO than a 6.5 Grendel...marketshare is a numbers game. I've been killing hogs using a 300BO using 110gr Barnes TSX at 2250fps with most of the pigs weighing between #125-#250, and some larger #300-#450. Hogs drop dead and taste great. Imagine the effect or simply additional confidence that a 150gr Speer Gold Dot bullet doing the same velocity would give the average Joe shooter. That is 40 extra grains.... almost same step-up from a 77gr 5.56 to a 123gr 6.5 Grendel.
I have friends who a die-hard fan-boys of particular guns or cartridges, Glock, Creedmoor, Grendel, AK's, and don't forget the Mosin Nagant fan club. I am not caliber-centric. I like right-sizing the cartridge to the desired use... I don't under-gun for a challenge when hunting because I believe in ethical kills. Also, I don't see a reason to over-gun a hunt. For any given shooting situation there are a several quality cartridges with overlapping performance that can be chosen. Optimizing the right balance of cartridge performance and rifle configuration is always my goal.
I like being intellectually honest - You mentioned the 300 HAMR has deficits in every category.... I think you should step back and take a better look at the Grendel. There are superior cartridges in every category with less tradeoff then the 6.5 Grendel as well. For hunting applications the 300HAMR is equal or better than 6.5 Grendel under 300 yards and in all SBR applications, plus ammo and reloading components (bullets and brass) are less expensive (20%-30%) for 300 HAMR. Also, as I recall the 6.8 SPC delivers more energy then 6.5 Grendel out to 450'ish yards. If your argument is based on higher BC of Grendel that makes it superior for distance then you now are talking about mid-range / long range and there are superior cartridges for this range like a Creedmoor and a number of other slightly larger cartridges that all eat its lunch. Big Caveat... in cartridges limited to 2.26" OAL the Grendel is the best all around cartridge... but only truly superior beyond 450yards but and 2nd best in most everything else in an AR15....
You should go check out the 300 HAMR Thread on Texas Hunting Forum. What you'll see/learn is a bunch a first-hand field experience with the cartridge and a lot of hunting photos of dead hogs, black bear, Elk, African Game, and small size game like deer. It's an eye opener.
I will continue to recommend the 6.5 Grendel for people who are interested in larger cartridge for AR15 and looking to shoot longer distances. As ammunition becomes more commonplace for 300 HAMR then I will start recommending it to friends looking for a more powerful hunting round (within 300 yards) and especially as a conversion/upgrade to 300BO.