Our military adopting the Grendel?
Irishman Wrote:....................the snipers still used the 14, 700 rem,and 70 win, not the 16, same as now, .............................
Irish I will disagree with the Winny 70 answer being used... answer is NO it's not being actively fielded could there be some floating about and being used sure just like to this day there is a M1911 somewhere in the inventory in some arms. Is the procurement active from Winchester, not at this time, to my knowledge. The USMC is using basically M700 short actions reworked to Remington 40X standards at Qauntico, not that far from you. The M24 series is built on a long action not short so if the need be to rechamber to 300 is needed simple barrel swap. The M14s are NOT M14s they are reworked to M21 standards aka NM, Designated marksmen (not sniper) are issued worked over M16 series, very few receive the M21. Those M21 as only issued when the food chain chooses that weapon as it is easier to rework a 16 into DMR status than to work a 14 to 21 status. The photos of all those 21s brought out the DMR program based on parts non-availablity lack of proper support etc, etc.
On your assessment about spraying and praying to clearify it a bit conjutures up images of 1 squeeze of the trigger = 20 to 30 rounds out the tube. The M16A2 and up DOES NOT do full AUTO rate as the A1- it is a three round burst weapon. This seems petty I know but it does clearify things for those whom do not vs those of us that do know of this fact.
Do Soldiers aim and use the 3 round burst ---yes--is it useful --- must be or the system would just order semi only versions, my experiance is that yes it is useful. Jamming a lot heck the AK will jam there are no Jam free semi or full auto weapons save a bolt action that won't jam. But as LR1955 has pointed out in several post here even the mighty 6.5G used in the AR platform Jams and has feeding issues just read. That is platform issue, not caliber issues, the ballistics that you also point out will also work out against the 6.5G in a comparision vs other calibers say the 260 Rem or the 6.5x284. Do I understand you bais against the 5.56 sure do and also I know that no matter how well it performs it will always jam in your and greyfox's eyes. I would only offer that since the changes in cartridge in conjuction with introduction of the A2 I personally have seen a better picture than that of a A1 series.
Guys I see your point and understand your view, but most of what I am hearing relates to the Platform about jamming, not terminal performance of the 5.56. Face it if the Platform jams with the 5.56 would it not have same issues with another caliber ?
If we as a group want to see the adoption of the 6.5G lose the AR platform develop something that would actually allow the cartridge to excel. Could this be done and keep the ergos of the M4 -yes. What limits the Grendel is the AR/M16 bolt.
----Added----- Sir your and greyfox's points well founded while it seems like I am on the attack against your statements I assure you your bottom line is not unfounded and within the A1 series I will mostly agree with yours and GreyFox's statements
Reply


Messages In This Thread
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-12-2011, 08:21 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-12-2011, 08:43 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-12-2011, 08:44 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-12-2011, 11:00 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-13-2011, 12:22 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 01:30 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 01:31 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-13-2011, 02:02 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 02:24 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-13-2011, 02:29 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-13-2011, 02:45 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-13-2011, 02:48 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-13-2011, 02:57 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 02:59 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-13-2011, 03:04 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 03:11 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 03:23 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by RStewart - 11-13-2011, 03:25 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-13-2011, 03:35 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by hm2 clark - 11-13-2011, 03:37 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 03:42 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-13-2011, 03:47 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 04:21 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-13-2011, 04:44 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-13-2011, 05:00 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-13-2011, 05:09 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 05:31 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by YutYut - 11-13-2011, 05:43 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by YutYut - 11-13-2011, 05:46 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 06:06 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 06:08 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by YutYut - 11-13-2011, 06:11 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-13-2011, 06:23 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 06:24 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by YutYut - 11-13-2011, 06:26 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 06:30 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 06:42 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by YutYut - 11-13-2011, 06:46 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 06:46 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 06:49 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Variable - 11-13-2011, 07:19 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-13-2011, 10:25 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-13-2011, 01:41 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by RStewart - 11-13-2011, 02:22 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-13-2011, 05:26 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-13-2011, 07:47 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by RStewart - 11-13-2011, 08:00 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-13-2011, 08:19 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-13-2011, 08:32 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-13-2011, 08:42 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 08:58 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by VASCAR2 - 11-13-2011, 09:17 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-13-2011, 09:25 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 09:48 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-13-2011, 11:02 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LR1955 - 11-13-2011, 11:02 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by montana - 11-13-2011, 11:42 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 12:02 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by fanofflyn - 11-14-2011, 12:11 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-14-2011, 12:19 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LR1955 - 11-14-2011, 12:32 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Mutt - 11-14-2011, 12:34 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 12:35 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-14-2011, 12:37 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-14-2011, 12:52 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-14-2011, 01:32 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 02:35 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-14-2011, 02:41 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 02:47 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 02:57 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-14-2011, 03:06 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 03:16 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 03:57 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-14-2011, 04:14 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 04:27 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by rasp65 - 11-14-2011, 04:28 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-14-2011, 05:00 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-14-2011, 05:34 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-14-2011, 05:50 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 06:56 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 07:00 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-14-2011, 12:13 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-14-2011, 12:33 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LR1955 - 11-14-2011, 12:58 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-14-2011, 01:24 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-14-2011, 01:33 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-14-2011, 02:47 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-14-2011, 03:06 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-14-2011, 03:27 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Texas Sheepdawg - 11-14-2011, 04:40 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Texas Sheepdawg - 11-14-2011, 04:43 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Greyfox - 11-14-2011, 05:41 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-14-2011, 05:58 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-14-2011, 06:42 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-14-2011, 06:45 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-14-2011, 06:56 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-14-2011, 06:57 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Grendel-Gene - 11-14-2011, 07:21 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 07:35 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-14-2011, 07:56 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-14-2011, 07:57 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 07:59 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-14-2011, 08:09 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-14-2011, 08:18 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 01:04 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 04:18 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by pinzgauer - 11-15-2011, 04:30 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-15-2011, 04:59 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-15-2011, 05:39 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 06:02 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Irishman - 11-15-2011, 06:22 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-15-2011, 06:28 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 06:36 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 06:50 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 06:51 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 07:15 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 07:30 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Mutt - 11-15-2011, 07:37 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 07:51 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 08:00 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 08:14 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 08:23 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 08:48 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 08:48 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 09:17 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 09:24 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-15-2011, 09:28 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 09:33 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 09:39 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 09:55 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by pinzgauer - 11-15-2011, 10:06 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 10:10 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 10:11 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 10:15 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-15-2011, 10:20 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 10:21 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-15-2011, 10:21 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 10:32 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 10:42 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-15-2011, 10:44 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 10:45 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 10:48 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-15-2011, 10:58 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 10:58 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by pinzgauer - 11-15-2011, 10:59 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-15-2011, 11:04 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 11:05 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-15-2011, 11:09 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-16-2011, 12:26 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-16-2011, 12:38 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-16-2011, 12:49 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-16-2011, 12:53 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-16-2011, 01:00 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by pinzgauer - 11-16-2011, 01:45 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-16-2011, 01:54 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-16-2011, 02:19 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-16-2011, 02:55 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-16-2011, 03:09 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-16-2011, 03:17 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-16-2011, 03:44 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-16-2011, 04:57 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by RangerRick - 11-16-2011, 05:19 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-16-2011, 06:29 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-16-2011, 03:19 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-16-2011, 03:25 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-16-2011, 04:21 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-16-2011, 05:24 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by Irishman - 11-17-2011, 02:56 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-17-2011, 03:26 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by JASmith - 11-17-2011, 03:44 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-17-2011, 04:03 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by LRRPF52 - 11-17-2011, 07:03 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-17-2011, 07:28 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-17-2011, 07:46 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-17-2011, 08:00 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by sgt_murf - 11-17-2011, 09:06 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-17-2011, 09:09 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-17-2011, 09:17 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-17-2011, 09:23 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-17-2011, 09:39 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-17-2011, 09:53 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-17-2011, 10:30 PM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-18-2011, 12:01 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-18-2011, 12:03 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-18-2011, 12:14 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by bwaites - 11-18-2011, 12:18 AM
Our military adopting the Grendel? - by stanc - 11-18-2011, 12:29 AM

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