Why is 6.8 SPC still a thing when 6.5 Grendel is more and more popular?

[ahillock]

Why are gun makers still putting effort into 6.8 SPC when it seems like it is a dead man walking? 6.5 Grendel is better in every aspect and is only growing in popularity. 6.8 SPC is a dead cartridge and I don't see why gun makers are still putting effort into it since it is a dead end instead of just jumping on the 6.5 Grendel train.

[Texas]

There are still die hard 6.8 fans because that is what they started with, and so that is the best, sorta like WORDSTAR and WORD in the computer industry.

Also, some people have a hard time admitting something is better or they are wrong.

[Kilco]

Hmmm touchy subject... even as a huge Grendel fanboy... "better" is very subjective to the users purpose.

Nothing wrong with the 6.8. For most shooters application, targets, water bottles and best of all, medium game/varmints the 6.5 and 6.8 comparison is moot. Out to Both cartridges effective killing range both have about the same energy, same killing power, and similar terminal ballistics.

It's really a pick your flavor kind of thing. People could say "why 243 when 260 is available" or "why 270 when 30-06 is available".... pick whatever tickles your pickle, and be careful not to pick on other people's flavors.. we are all 2A bretheren!

[LR1955]

Hmmm touchy subject... even as a huge Grendel fanboy... "better" is very subjective to the users purpose.

Nothing wrong with the 6.8. For most shooters application, targets, water bottles and best of all, medium game/varmints the 6.5 and 6.8 comparison is moot. Out to Both cartridges effective killing range both have about the same energy, same killing power, and similar terminal ballistics.

It's really a pick your flavor kind of thing. People could say "why 243 when 260 is available" or "why 270 when 30-06 is available".... pick whatever tickles your pickle, and be careful not to pick on other people's flavors.. we are all 2A bretheren!

Exactly!

I do not own a 6.8, either.

I figure if the 6.8 was a lousy cartridge, no one would be shooting it anymore and it would disappear.

One thing I can't figure out is why anyone would care what cartridge someone else happens to like. It is not like Grendel components and uppers are not being produced in order to produce 6.8 components and uppers.

So it goes.

LR55

[Lightning8]

For a time, it seemed easier to get factory brass cased ammo for the 6.8 - there were always deals on the S&B ammo. 6.8 built up a following as a hunting cartridge while 6.5G was seen as a target cartridge. If I was starting today I would just get the 6.5G but I have a nice 14.5 6.8 upper with a pinned AAC flash-hider that make a great suppressed hunter and a nice 20 inch 6.5 Grendel for long range work and long range hunting. Lots more factory ammo for 6.5G recently - thanks to Hornady for their "Black" line for 6.5G.

[BluntForceTrauma]

I think we've largely put the 6.X wars to rest — except for that Army-Navy sort of rivalry.

I agree with shooters sticking together; our ARs come under attack on a regular basis, so no sense in friendly fire incidents.

The 6.8 does what it needs to do for those who happen to prefer it.

What happens to it in the market in the big picture is above my pay grade.

Buy and shoot what you think is cool!

Did I mention 6.5 Grendel has Wolf steel-case for, now, 22¢ round? Bwhahahaha! :p

[Ditcher]

I use to think the 6.8 was the best thing out there in the ar15 long ago. Then I started reading more and more about the 6.5G and was saying 6.8 who?
I noticed a lot people not to familiar with the 6.5G think it sounds out of anything less then 20" barrel which we know here is not true. Better in short barrel then the other 4 popular calibers.
Now I don't have my 6.5G build yet but I was reading people having issues with magazine with the 6.5G. Read this over on ARfcom. Can anyone here comfirm this?
I heard people having good results with the E-Landers.
Edit to add the cost of ammo might be holding back some people. I know the steel case ammo is the same price as the x39 but I know alot of people don't like shooting steel case ammo.

[Kilco]

Now I don't have my 6.5G build yet but I was reading people having issues with magazine with the 6.5G. Read this over on ARfcom. Can anyone here comfirm this?
I heard people having good results with the E-Landers.

1300 rounds downrange using CPD and e-lander mags and I haven't had a single mag related issue...

No issues at all actually..

[Ditcher]

That's good to hear.

[VASCAR2]

The problem with magazines is a few out of spec mags hit the market by all the manufactures whether ASC, C Products Defense or E-Lander. Many times problem mags can be fixed by tweaking/adjusting the feed lips. Some times mags slip through that have poor welds. I’ve found cleaning the inside of the mag body on ASC mags is helpful plus removing any excess molded plastic on the followers. I usually load my magazine and let them set loaded till I go to the range. Most 6.5 Grendel mags have stiff springs. Leaving the mags loaded seems to help the mags wear in faster.

As long as you buy the 6.5 Grendel mags from a reputable company/vendor with good customer service where you can return problem mags I think your gtg. With the popularity of gun forums if anyone has problems with mags you read about it. It’s kind of hard to gauge the failure rate for each given brand of 6.5 Grendel mags.

Alexander Arms used to inspect the magazines they received from ASC and sold with AA floor plate. Generally the AA marked mags seem to get better reviews than other ASC mags. AR Stoner are rebranded ASC mags unless they have recently changed.

The general consensus is the most unreliable 6.5 Grendel mags are the C Products/ASC 14 round mag that has the same dimensions as a 20 round 5.56/223. For the most part the other capacity 6.5 Grendel mags on the market are reliable.

[Djgrendel]

After much research, I picked the grendel. It fit my requirements just a little better. I cast no shade on the 6.8. It is another option for us to use. Anybody using either choice will not be be wrong. I think the shooting community is very lucky to have so many options. Pick your tool, and use it to the best ability!

[Sticks]

...

Did I mention 6.5 Grendel has Wolf steel-case for, now, 22¢ round? Bwhahahaha! :p

The absolute best group that I have been able to get with Wolf is 1.3 MOA, and that followed a bughole 5 shot group of ELD (.31MOA). One of those rare occasions I was on my game. Wolf is usually 2+ MOA, which is unacceptable to me.

Now, if they actually get a bullet that is .264, not .2615 in future production, I'll try it again. Debating on selling off what I have, or continue with my Moscow Match trials if I can get my hands on some stupid cheap 120gr bullets.

6.8 - I have yet to see anyone shooting one, but I don't get out much. Since the Military briefly had it under consideration, and Federal backed it, it's a sure bet that it is not going away.

[Lastrites]

Tale from the far side of the sixeight, had one back in the day. Waited till the ice melted on the promised cheap practice ammo which has ended up being just a teaser lie and if you think Grendels are mag finicky I suggest you spend some time with this caliber as they can be every bit as fickle and the ones that do run are about $35/$45 a pop. Chamber issues, well it likely has as many different chambers floating around as the 6.5 pending on where you source the barrel.

Both do a similar jobs, one just seems to have the leg's of a runway model and the other of an Umpa.

[LR1955]

The absolute best group that I have been able to get with Wolf is 1.3 MOA, and that followed a bughole 5 shot group of ELD (.31MOA). One of those rare occasions I was on my game. Wolf is usually 2+ MOA, which is unacceptable to me.

Now, if they actually get a bullet that is .264, not .2615 in future production, I'll try it again. Debating on selling off what I have, or continue with my Moscow Match trials if I can get my hands on some stupid cheap 120gr bullets.

6.8 - I have yet to see anyone shooting one, but I don't get out much. Since the Military briefly had it under consideration, and Federal backed it, it's a sure bet that it is not going away.

Sticks:

Absolutely correct. A person can spend $.22 to make noise or they can buy or handload something with a bullet that is really .264 and see that it shoots so much better. Or do what you did and pull / push using a bullet that cost another $.25 or so. The cheapo Wolf ammo can shoot if someone is willing to spend twice as much as it cost for a new bullet plus what ever their time is worth.

And if some of you guys haven't seen what Sticks did you can search for 'Moscow Match' and see for yourselves.

LR55

[JASmith]

Why are gun makers still putting effort into 6.8 SPC when it seems like it is a dead man walking? 6.5 Grendel is better in every aspect and is only growing in popularity. 6.8 SPC is a dead cartridge and I don't see why gun makers are still putting effort into it since it is a dead end instead of just jumping on the 6.5 Grendel train.

At some point, we see a phenomena much like why the venerable 30-30 and 45-70 should be dead man walking too.

Of course, the huge nostalgia factor is there but, for many, it is the skinny blonde versus buxom brunette decision.

Further, the name recognition factor is alive and well. For example, one of the most popular paintings is the one of Mona Lisa even though it is not particularly good art. She got notoriety when misplaced. Her return brought folks flocking to see her. The 'name recognition brought more and so the cycle continues.

Bottom line, we like it because we like it.

Both the Grendel and the SPC communities will both flourish for a long time and we Grendeliers can treasure the knowledge that our cartridge does well enough for most tasks and does better than others for many tasks.

[bj139]

Sticks:

Absolutely correct. A person can spend $.22 to make noise or they can buy or handload something with a bullet that is really .264 and see that it shoots so much better. Or do what you did and pull / push using a bullet that cost another $.25 or so. The cheapo Wolf ammo can shoot if someone is willing to spend twice as much as it cost for a new bullet plus what ever their time is worth.

And if some of you guys haven't seen what Sticks did you can search for 'Moscow Match' and see for yourselves.

LR55

Wolf steel bullet ammo is good for finish polishing of cheap barrels.

I am currently polishing a BCA barrel. I have about 60 rounds through it.
My last barrel was more precise after I put about 200 rounds of Wolf through it.

[Cornbread]

Why are gun makers still putting effort into 6.8 SPC when it seems like it is a dead man walking? 6.5 Grendel is better in every aspect and is only growing in popularity. 6.8 SPC is a dead cartridge and I don't see why gun makers are still putting effort into it since it is a dead end instead of just jumping on the 6.5 Grendel train.

Why don't you go post this on the 68 forum and see what answers you get. I have rifles in both calibers. For deer hunting at ranges that MOST hunters routinely shoot deer there is not a whole lot of difference in the two. Why is the 30-30 or the 30/06 still supported. Certainly there are newer and better rounds out there. Truth is the Grendel was a proprietary cartridge for too long. Allowed the 6.8 to get a head start. The 6.5 is catching up but at the local Bass pro, Cabelas, Academy it's still 3-1 6.8 versus 6.5 ammo. Ultimately the market will decide based on sales. I have a feeling both rounds will be around for some time.

[ahillock]

Hmmm touchy subject... even as a huge Grendel fanboy... "better" is very subjective to the users purpose.

Nothing wrong with the 6.8. For most shooters application, targets, water bottles and best of all, medium game/varmints the 6.5 and 6.8 comparison is moot. Out to Both cartridges effective killing range both have about the same energy, same killing power, and similar terminal ballistics.

It's really a pick your flavor kind of thing. People could say "why 243 when 260 is available" or "why 270 when 30-06 is available".... pick whatever tickles your pickle, and be careful not to pick on other people's flavors.. we are all 2A bretheren!

Exactly!

I do not own a 6.8, either.

I figure if the 6.8 was a lousy cartridge, no one would be shooting it anymore and it would disappear.

One thing I can't figure out is why anyone would care what cartridge someone else happens to like. It is not like Grendel components and uppers are not being produced in order to produce 6.8 components and uppers.

So it goes.

LR55

This isn't meant to be a touchy subject nor picking on other people's flavors. We can have this discussion as those interested in firearms without those on one side feeling picked on.

As LRRPF52 has shown several times on this forum, 6.5 Grendel >>> 6.8 SPC in every way. From long range precision shooting, to hunting loads, to SBR, to suppressed...etc. I don't know of one thing that the 6.8 offers that the 6.5 also matches and if not exceeds in performance. I don't know in what case one would pick a 6.8 SPC over a 6.5G, if for no other purpose than to be different. If looking strictly at performance, I don't see any case where the 6.8 SPC performs any better.

[Kilco]

This isn't meant to be a touchy subject nor picking on other people's flavors. We can have this discussion as those interested in firearms without those on one side feeling picked on.

As LRRPF52 has shown several times on this forum, 6.5 Grendel >>> 6.8 SPC in every way. From long range precision shooting, to hunting loads, to SBR, to suppressed...etc. I don't know of one thing that the 6.8 offers that the 6.5 also matches and if not exceeds in performance. I don't know in what case one would pick a 6.8 SPC over a 6.5G, if for no other purpose than to be different. If looking strictly at performance, I don't see any case where the 6.8 SPC performs any better.

Sounds like you have your favorite and your opinion on the matter. That's what's important.

When it comes to rifles, especially regarding two cartridges as close in performance as these two, "performs" is an extremely tacky term to use.

When they are this close, the "performs" departments is 100% in the shooters hands.

[41bear]

Sounds much like the 270 Winchester V the 280 Remington or many other flavor of the week cartridges I've witnessed over the years. While I like the 6.5 Grendel my Son in Law likes his 6.8 SPC II mine is a tad more accurate while his is a tad faster. I would suspect the animals we harvest wouldn't know or care which they were taken with and when we are enjoying the results at the dinner table neither would we. So I'm with the group that says shoot what you like and more power to you.