More reason then ever to Keep and Bear Arms

[Drift]

I'll try and keep this as respectful and apolitical as I can. I just watched the POTUS speak from the oval office. As I listened through the static (that is always heard in a political speech) what came through loud and clear was (1) terrorism is going to be a"new normal" in the US. (2) He is OK with us fighting it here rather than "over there". (3) He would rather the civilian population disarm ourselves in this country now that terrorists are here. Some other pleasantries were said...but thats the message that came through.
Lots of conclusions can be drawn from those 3 messages. But what I want to concentrate on is that we have been told whats coming. It's not SHTF time, but a little preparation is in order. Like (a) more range time (b)carry all the time-long guns like the Grendel will be important © Social networking with your friends and neighbors so when it comes apart you all have a PLAN in place to provide for your own common defense.
Other people may have other opinions... They are welcome to them

[LRRPF52]

It makes sense if you don't think about it. We are being subjected to more attacks at home, so we should surrender the tools that may be able to protect us when moments count.

[stanc]

Regarding your points:

(1) I didn't notice anything like that.
(2) I didn't notice anything like that, either. In any case, the male shooter in San Bernardino was a US citizen, and so could not be fought "over there."
(3) He is anti-gun. What do you expect?

(a) Practice is good, even without a threat of terrorist attack.
(b) A concealed carry handgun that is immediately accessible makes far more sense than a rifle in the trunk of your vehicle. As seen in Paris and San Bernardino, such attacks happen very quickly, and you probably won't have time to get to your rifle.
© We're talking 1 or 2 individuals, probably, up to 8 or so, possibly. Not an invading army, let alone TEOTWAWKI. It'll be over before you have time to rendezvous with your family and friends.

[JASmith]

Drift, you make excellent sense.

Too many of us are in a state of denial.

That having been said, I remember a passage in Heinlein's Tunnel in the Sky, 1955 where several candidates for a survival course were rejected for being over equipped. The protagonist was accepted because, if anything he was under equipped with just two knives and the sure knowledge that a firearm could lead one into confrontations that are best avoided. In other words the protagonist was well prepared with knowledge and appropriate attitude.

There are also self-defense experts who advocate that there is no such thing as being too prepared.

Many knowledgeable folks also argue that one should not bring a knife to a gunfight. These confrontations are largely gunfights, so having one's pistol to carry makes sense. Further, the shooting in San Bernardino lasted eight minutes. That is adequate time to get to one's vehicle and retrieve a long gun if the defender has the opportunity.

In any event, we all need to maintain good situational awareness whether or not we carry. The awareness should include noting objects that can be used for defense from or distracting the shooters.

[montana]

Regarding your points:

(1) I didn't notice anything like that.
(2) I didn't notice anything like that, either. In any case, the male shooter in San Bernardino was a US citizen, and so could not be fought "over there."
(3) He is anti-gun. What do you expect?

(a) Practice is good, even without a threat of terrorist attack.
(b) A concealed carry handgun that is immediately accessible makes far more sense than a rifle in the trunk of your vehicle. As seen in Paris and San Bernardino, such attacks happen very quickly, and you probably won't have time to get to your rifle.
© We're talking 1 or 2 individuals, probably, up to 8 or so, possibly. Not an invading army, let alone TEOTWAWKI. It'll be over before you have time to rendezvous with your family and friends.

Politics put aside I have never seen this country in such disarray regarding foreign and domestic policy. Whether it is local or foreign scum bags, I think it is safe to say terrorism is going to be the norm since we don't seem to have adults running our government. There are many in this country today who put their political interest, religion and personal interest ahead of what is best for this country. This is why we have the second amendment, to protect our selves and our Constitution. I never gave an oath to an imperium empire but to the Constitution of the United States. It is our duty to arm, and train ourselves to protect not only our selves but the citizens around us.

[SHORT-N-SASSY]

Regarding your points:
. . .
(b) A concealed carry handgun that is immediately accessible makes far more sense than a rifle in the trunk of your vehicle. . . .

[SIZE="3"]Or, a compact Individual Multi-Purpose weapon, such as the 1970's IMP-221, upgraded to the 21st Century 6.5mm Grendel chambering and carried/stored, discreetly, in a standard size briefcase ---




[/SIZE]

[stanc]

Or, a compact Individual Multi-Purpose weapon, such as the 1970's IMP-221, upgraded to the 21st Century 6.5mm Grendel chambering and carried/stored, discreetly, in a standard size briefcase ---

Um, okay. Where does a person buy one?

[1075 tech]

Two quick stories of recent experiences:

Early this year, I was standing in line at McDonald's. An older gentleman and his wife were in line in front of me. He was wearing a Korean War Veteran hat. He turned around and looked me in the eye and asked if I had a weapon. I nodded yes. He went on to tell me that there will be fighting in the streets. That ISIS [U]is here[U]. He showed me his Marine Corp graduation picture and went on to talk about his experiences at Chosin. He said he wanted to re-up but they wouldn't let him because he was too old.

Thanksgiving morning I had been out hunting with my daughter. On our way back to the truck, we walk a tractor path that goes directly behind several houses. As we walked by, an elderly gentleman was standing next to the fence so we said hello and Happy Thanksgiving. As we talked, I learned that he was a 91 year old WWII veteran. He also made it clear of what he felt was coming. He said he still had his service rifle and ammo stored away for that day.

Another KW Vet I know believes that the current administration will purposely cause or allow something to happen to justify declaring martial law and stay in power.

The point being, if these, and other, more "seasoned" people can see the writing on the wall, is the general populace blind or ignorant? Or do they stick their heads in the sand and pretend that everything will somehow be OK.

Here in NY, one of our local sheriffs ignited a firestorm when he suggested that everyone who has a license to carry do so. He also asked that all current and retired LEO's carry at all times.

[customcutter]

I think the opportunity to fight them over there has passed. Our POTUS is going to bring them here by the 10's of thousands as refugees with no means to vette them. Yes he says we shouldn't allow people on no-fly list to purchase guns, I've received e-mails stating that there are literally thousands of people on the no-fly list that shouldn't be on there, including a six year old. We are fighting religious fanatics, that believe you either convert to Islam or you are beheaded. I only know enough about Sharia Law to know that I don't want anything to do with it. It's hard to defeat a cancerous ideology, when you are brought up in it from an infant.

The POTUS says he wants Congress to stop people on the no-fly list from buying guns. I've received several e-mails in the last few days stating that there are literally thousands of US citizens on the no-fly list that shouldn't be on them. One was a six year old boy. I wrote my Congressmen after the shooting at the Navy Recruiting Station asking them to start legislation to ban Muslims from owning firearms. I think that being able to defend one's family is a God given right, it's only spelled out in the Constitution. We rounded up the Japanese after Peal Harbor and put them in camps, I think the least we can do is vette Muslims that want to own firearms.

Jerry Falwell Jr was on the news this AM. He encouraged every student, and faculty member at Liberty University (IIRC) to get CCW, and start carrying on campus.

[VASCAR2]

If future attacks occur they will more than likely be soft targets like, grocery stores, churches or even nursing homes. The Militants are trying to garner attention and attack where we least expect it. Considering that some converts are even coming from our prisons there is really no part of the country that may not be targeted. I'm a retired LEO and have carried concealed my whole adult life. I urge anyone who can get a CCW/CCL to get one, get some training and prepare.

I frequently visit my Daughter who lives in a metro area 350 miles away. Every time I go to here house my Tavor goes with me. I am used to having long guns in my vehicle since I was a LEO and hopefully I never need either my pistol or rifle. If the balloon goes up and all you have is a pistol I hope you understand firearms well enough to pick up one of the assailants rifles to use in the event you run low on ammo or need to go rifle against rifle versus pistol against rifle.

I live in the Midwest and I'm constantly talking to other men (usually in the sporting goods section) that have expressed every concern that has all ready been mentioned. I think our country is as close to the summer of 1939 as I could ever imagine. The state of affairs has even been noticed by my wife who has become a prepper and stockpiling.

[stanc]

I wrote my Congressmen after the shooting at the Navy Recruiting Station asking them to start legislation to ban Muslims from owning firearms. I think that being able to defend one's family is a God given right, it's only spelled out in the Constitution.

:confused: Apparently you don't see the contradiction in those two sentences.

We rounded up the Japanese after Peal Harbor and put them in camps, I think the least we can do is vette Muslims that want to own firearms.

The vast majority of mass shootings in this country have been done by non-Muslims. Shouldn't we thoroughly vet everybody who wants to own firearms?

[danm]

I ALWAYS carry a pistol with me but never have a rifle in my vehicle... That's changing after this last shooting, headed to goodwill to look for an unassuming sport/duffel bag for my 10.5" (29" oal) 5.56 AR pistol...

[LRRPF52]

One of my neighbors invented an armored desktop that can stop M855, that kids can use in a classroom as shields.

That's another option that could have worked very well in San Bernardino, in addition to CCW holders ventilating the heads of the militant murderers on a mission to kill.

Tools aside, there are basically 3 things you can do in these scenarios:

Run
Hide
Fight

Depending on where the enemy is and your ability to ascertain situational awareness, that will steer you in the best path from the above list. I've been watching the AAR comments from the band, Eagles of Death Metal, after watching so many of their friends and fans gunned down. In the chaos, many people ran into dead ends, and were systematically gunned down once the savages found them. Nobody was armed or able to defend themselves, and many people insisted on staying with their friends rather than leave them to bleed out alone, costing them their lives as well.

They were holed up in a room, where they had to listen to magazine after magazine emptied into people. Just when they thought it would end, they reloaded, found another set of victims, and murdered them over another period of minutes. This went on much longer than it would seem from what you saw from the presstitutes.

One of the best things you can do is be in optimum physical shape. Having all the cool toys will do you no good if you are out of breath, unable to extract yourself and friends, neighbors, coworkers, or loved ones from one of these encounters. As I watched footage from San Bernardino, even many of the LEO's were terribly out of shape.

[danm]

One of my neighbors invented an armored desktop that can stop M855, that kids can use in a classroom as shields.

That's another option that could have worked very well in San Bernardino, in addition to CCW holders ventilating the heads of the militant murderers on a mission to kill.

Tools aside, there are basically 3 things you can do in these scenarios:

Run
Hide
Fight

Depending on where the enemy is and your ability to ascertain situational awareness, that will steer you in the best path from the above list. I've been watching the AAR comments from the band, Eagles of Death Metal, after watching so many of their friends and fans gunned down. In the chaos, many people ran into dead ends, and were systematically gunned down once the savages found them. Nobody was armed or able to defend themselves, and many people insisted on staying with their friends rather than leave them to bleed out alone, costing them their lives as well.

They were holed up in a room, where they had to listen to magazine after magazine emptied into people. Just when they thought it would end, they reloaded, found another set of victims, and murdered them over another period of minutes. This went on much longer than it would seem from what you saw from the presstitutes.

One of the best things you can do is be in optimum physical shape. Having all the cool toys will do you no good if you are out of breath, unable to extract yourself and friends, neighbors, coworkers, or loved ones from one of these encounters. As I watched footage from San Bernardino, even many of the LEO's were terribly out of shape.

That's interesting, I noticed the exact same thing... She's probably a great officer but the one that stood out to me looked like she could barely walk let alone chase and apprehend anyone...

[stanc]

Two quick stories of recent experiences:

Early this year, I was standing in line at McDonald's. An older gentleman...asked if I had a weapon. I nodded yes. He went on to tell me that there will be fighting in the streets. That ISIS [U]is here[U].

Thanksgiving morning I had been out hunting with my daughter. On our way back to the truck...an elderly gentleman was standing next to the fence so we said hello and Happy Thanksgiving. As we talked, I learned that he was a 91 year old WWII veteran. He also made it clear of what he felt was coming.

Another KW Vet I know believes that the current administration will purposely cause or allow something to happen to justify declaring martial law and stay in power.

The point being, if these, and other, more "seasoned" people can see the writing on the wall, is the general populace blind or ignorant? Or do they stick their heads in the sand and pretend that everything will somehow be OK.

A few comments:

1. In other forums, I have seen a number of people say, "ISIS is here." But when asked for proof that ISIS fighters actually are in this country, they cannot provide it.

2. There is no age limit on paranoia. For the last 30 or 40 years there have been gun owners who worried that the government was going to become tyrannical. It never happened.

3. Just because some people don't reach the conclusions that people like you do, doesn't mean that they are blind or ignorant or "sticking their heads in the sand." It just means that they have a different opinion, which is neither more nor less valid than yours.

[stanc]

I think our country is as close to the summer of 1939 as I could ever imagine. The state of affairs has even been noticed by my wife who has become a prepper and stockpiling.

Many years ago I (along with countless other people) had similar concerns, and did the same sort of things. Except back then we were called survivalists.

All that time and money spent proved to be for naught...

[stanc]

If future attacks occur they will more than likely be soft targets like, grocery stores, churches or even nursing homes.

Ha! I should be so lucky.

[Jackem]

Statistically a driver with a smart phone texting is much more of a threat than a terrorist with a gun to all of us that live and drive in the US. Some 1500 people die every day directly tied to texting rather than terrorism that killed 14 a few days back.

I'm old and probably missing something here, but in my day to day life I've yet to be threatened by terrorism--except on the news which brings up my question; How much does media hype drive public reactions and for what purpose?

If the mass media's agenda is to scare us into more draconian gun control it's working: My mother-in-law told my wife yesterday she was thinking about turning her handgun into the police dept. since the terrible massacre in San Bernardino...


Annual United States Road Crash Statistics

Over 37,000 people die in road crashes each year
An additional 2.35 million are injured or disabled
Over 1,600 children under 15 years of age die each year
Nearly 8,000 people are killed in crashes involving drivers ages 16-20
Road crashes cost the U.S. $230.6 billion per year, or an average of $820 per person
Road crashes are the single greatest annual cause of death of healthy U.S. citizens traveling abroad
http://asirt.org/initiatives/informing-r...statistics

Food for thought,

Jack

[montana]

Many years ago I (along with countless other people) had similar concerns, and did the same sort of things. Except back then we were called survivalists.

All that time and money spent proved to be for naught...

I beg to differ stanc. The late 70's and 80's survivalist movement brought the knowledge of self sufficiently to many who would never have given it a second thought. Being a prepper, survivalist or what ever one wishes to call it isn't a waste of time when applied to everyday life. I'm not talking about nut cases who hide in a hole afraid to live their lives but individuals who apply survival knowledge in everyday life. I'm an Eagle scout and our motto was be prepared. Being prepared is not paranoid or a waste of time and money. I personally have benefited from acquired knowledge and preparedness in my life. Much of my successes in life was survival knowledge given to me from my late father as I pass it on to my family. I can not count all the money I have spent on insurance, fire extinguishers, Dr. check ups and so forth in my life but I wouldn't call it a waste of money. After every heavy snow storm I can see which neighbors did or didn't plan for one of the un expected interruptions in life. I can think of lessor activities people waste their time and money on instead of preparedness . Each to their own.

[SHORT-N-SASSY]

Um, okay. Where does a person buy one?

[SIZE="3"]Unfortunately, the Bushmaster Arm Pistol is quite rare (https://www.gunsamerica.com/916119844/Gw...ullpup.htm). However, the upcoming Desert Tech MDR-C is close ---


[/SIZE]