What would you run?

[Zeneffect]

THE BOB DORTON “SHUT UP and SHOOT” MATCH

INSTRUCTIONS

MATCH: The match will be shot on ALL (4) silhouette distances.
Know your scope come ups before coming to the match.
This is an Individual match – Not a Team match.

TIME: November 11, 2023. Range 6
0700 drawing for lane assignments and target setup.
0745 Safety Brief
0800 Begin Match
Individual Entry Fee is $25.00 (with a maximum of 40 Shooters)

CALIBERS: From .223 to .308 bore caliber. No Magnums. Bore calibers will determine the classes. Need 3 entries of the same bore caliber to be award eligible. (Example: .223, 22-250, 222 or any .223 bore caliber makes a class.)

TARGETS: Targets will present a high degree of difficulty and offer a test of equipment and shooter skills.

COURSE OF FIRE:
Match will have 4 Stages consisting of: 10 targets at 500 meters, 10 targets at 385 meters, a combination of 10 targets at 500 and 300 meters and a combination of 10 targets at 385 and 200 meters.
No sighters or Spotters. You just come to the firing line, set up, and wait for the “load” and “commence firing” commands to be given. Next shooter in line will be the Scorekeeper. Scorekeeper will keep the score from behind the yellow line. There will be NO coaching the shooter on the firing line.
Match will be shot in 4 stages. 10 shot strings for record (one shot per designated target) All waiting to shoot will be silent during the 10 minute period of shooting.
Time limit of 10 minutes per Stage. Shooter and Scorekeeper will go down and verify hits, then reset the targets.

**NOTE: The shooter is allowed one shot only on each of ten designated targets starting at the left and ending on the right. A “knock down” equals 1 point. If the shooter misses a target, he/she must proceed to the next target in line. X = Hit - O= Miss.
TIE SCORES: In the event of a tie, the caliber class winners will be determined by hits on the smallest target at the greater distance.

AWARDS: Awards will be made to the top shooter based on highest
score. Each caliber class will need 3 or more shooters for an
award pay-out.

EQUIPTMENT:
Any type of front shooting platform is allowed. Rear support is allowed. Soft point, hollow point and poly tip bullets only. No FMJ or other types. Each shooter will be allowed 5 minutes to set up shooting equipment prior to the actual shooting time of 10 minutes.

ENTRY FEE: $25.00 Cash or check.
Make checks payable to Tom Lyon or FSC.

___ Check

___ Cash


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I removed this info.

The question is, what would you run? Given the similarity to the previous match.... I think its time for the 105 matchkings to do their thing again. Why not run more umpf? Don't need to, I just need to spot my miss which is waaay easier to do. Drop means nothing, I'm dialing turrets. Wind might matter but I can get them going pretty dang fast to almost not care. If I run 6.5 grendel, this puts me shooting against 6.5 creed by the rules and I think I want to run the 22" uintah just so I don't have to chase my brass after shooting... 2830fps is fast enough.

This match was just announced a few hours ago so the wheels have begun spinning on how best to approach. I already know what optic I'm going to run (and it's not the nightforce) as it's the only one (well two actually) with 1/8 Moa click value I have (burris xtrii 8-40x50 dch f-clas 2nd focal plane, nightforce 20moa mount)

[CJW]

Zen,
This sounds like great fun.


C

[Zeneffect]

Been having dreams of running a small cased 6mm over 3000fps with bullets in the .500bc range. I don't think arc will get me there

[jasper2408]

Any idea how big the smallest target is? I was messing around with QT for the fun of it using the Sierra 105gr Blitzking and 2830fps velocity and 50 degree temps.
You could zero for 500m and 385m separate for those target stages.
Then zero at 410m for the 500m-300m and aim center with a little over 3.3" high or low depending on the distance.
Then zero at 295m for the 385m-200m targets and aim center with 2.5" high or low depending on the distance.

This was worked up in QT at 50 degrees so this data may be off as the temps might be lower and the fps lower on the day of the shoot which may change the trajectory.

[Zeneffect]

Ping pong ball. Since I'm 2nd focal plane I'm going to dial the shortest of the 2 distances, then back off magnification so the 2nd crosshair aligns with 2nd target. Only thing to account for is wind. 40x zoom capability puts me at about 28x for 500 and 300m with the retice. I plan to keep track of it all by just coming prepared and using some good old fashioned tape and a marker

[lazyengineer]

While this sounds like fun, here's hoping your squads are quite small [COLOR="#0000FF"]"Match will be shot in 4 stages. 10 shot strings for record (one shot per designated target) All waiting to shoot will be silent during the 10 minute period of shooting.
Time limit of 10 minutes per Stage. Shooter and Scorekeeper will go down and verify hits, then reset the targets.[/COLOR]"

10 minutes PLUS going several hundred yards downrange to verify hits? That's going to be long day if there are more than 4 or 5 to a squad.

For gear, here's what I shoot at 600 yards quite nicely:

It's a 1/9 twist 20" Alexander HBAR 6.5 Grendel on a PSA kit on an Anderson lower with a LaRue 2-stage trigger, and a Primary Arms 2.5-10x GLX scope and a $21 Amazon bipod (I went fancy and spent the extra $4 for the graphite legs), and the scope is on a $26 UTG mount. This rig that outshoots my AR10 in 6.5CM every time at 600 yards and has shoot a 200-clean in more than one AR-tactical 600 yard mid-range match (when I read the wind correctly that is). I finally just sold the AR10.



I shoot 107 SMK's when shooting for score at 600 yards. Here's my label (it's hot, work up to it)





Alternatively, a Ruger Precision Rifle in 6.5 Creedmoor will likely do even better, since it sounds like there's no competitor run and gun movement involved, but that this is more of a prone-match on a gong-range. If there were also CQB engagement aspects and this were more of action match, then I'd switch to the 14.5 pin & weld Grendel.

[grayfox]

I've got loads in 6Arc for my uintah, 22" barrel, 95 SMK, BC 0.480, 2858 with varget.
Lever might get me 100 fps more but I haven't tried that, haven't had the need to right now.
The 95 TMK is 0.500.

If there's no running/gunning, I would however, do my 6mm Creed.
107 SMK 0.537 or so, 2955. But I'm not practiced enough to do that kind of comp.
Good luck to ya!

[Zeneffect]

The way the line is split up its in 2 sections. The 500+ 300 and 385 + 200. Each section has 5 positions each so in total there should be 10 shooters at the line at a time. No run and gun... no spotter also so self spot. This is where I think creedmoor will suffer vs grendel. I will miss, and so will everyone else there is no question to it. It's a matter of how to recover the data from the miss and I think maintaining sight picture to impact is key. With a small target and high magnification spotting the miss might be difficult if the rifle jumps at all, and the more powder available, the more likely it is to occur.

That 107 load is exactly what I'm looking for. I have the components in some abundance and not scared of a load that is a little hot. I have spare barrels and bolts counting on something to break eventually.

Also inspecting targets does not require walking out to them, we drive out in our cars with the line clear. Nobody wants to walk 1km then go shoot for fun. We keep it pretty relaxed

[LRRPF52]

The way the line is split up its in 2 sections. The 500+ 300 and 385 + 200. Each section has 5 positions each so in total there should be 10 shooters at the line at a time. No run and gun... no spotter also so self spot. This is where I think creedmoor will suffer vs grendel. I will miss, and so will everyone else there is no question to it. It's a matter of how to recover the data from the miss and I think maintaining sight picture to impact is key. With a small target and high magnification spotting the miss might be difficult if the rifle jumps at all, and the more powder available, the more likely it is to occur.

That 107 load is exactly what I'm looking for. I have the components in some abundance and not scared of a load that is a little hot. I have spare barrels and bolts counting on something to break eventually.

Also inspecting targets does not require walking out to them, we drive out in our cars with the line clear. Nobody wants to walk 1km then go shoot for fun. We keep it pretty relaxed

I don’t think there is enough difference between the 107gr SMK and 105gr to matter if they both shoot.

Your approach for being able to maintain sight picture will absolutely give you an advantage over the 6.5 Creedmoor, which is why so many people shoot 103-108gr 6mm in PRS.

The milder the rifle behavior, the better. You want point & click, not “BANG and what happened?”.

I would prefer an FFP reticle with Mil or MOA hashes for reference for that though, with a tree reticle. Gives you reference points for your impact registers and real-time POI feedback vs guessing the abyss.

[Zeneffect]

Only 1 way to find out, compare group sizes at 100 then 300 to see if a little more down range makes them open up, or tighten up. Per the rules... I should be able to use some gadgets. If I'm not allowed spotter feedback I do have a way to replay my last shot while on the line (from a watch no less!) Latest updates upped the playback frame rate and gave me full camera control

https://youtube.com/shorts/WAvnZqv_rxg?feature=shared

Some people might have an issue with this, but only because they aren't smart enough to think of it first then get it working.

So the 107s run mid 2900s from a creedmoor.... (looks at 28" krieger)

[grayfox]

yeah, 107 6mm SMK, using 4451 or staball 6.5 or h4350 take your choice. I think I'm running staball in them, peterson brass, 2.745-ish and 2955, right at a node for 26" barrel.
Bergara makes a darn fine rifle in the mid 1400's for hmr with cheek adjust. I splurged (for me )
Not much reticle movement if any, last time I shot it, to 300 yds. Smack dab on the steel!

[LR1955]

Only 1 way to find out, compare group sizes at 100 then 300 to see if a little more down range makes them open up, or tighten up. Per the rules... I should be able to use some gadgets. If I'm not allowed spotter feedback I do have a way to replay my last shot while on the line (from a watch no less!) Latest updates upped the playback frame rate and gave me full camera control

https://youtube.com/shorts/WAvnZqv_rxg?feature=shared

Some people might have an issue with this, but only because they aren't smart enough to think of it first then get it working.

So the 107s run mid 2900s from a creedmoor.... (looks at 28" krieger)

ZE:

Wow!

Hope your fellow shooters see your post here and realize they weren't 'smart enough' to come up with your gadget first.


LR-55

[Zeneffect]

Fellow shooters ignore grendel as inferior to the arc. I tend to disagree, though I haven't tried the arc personally.