Posts: 7
Threads: 3
Joined: Nov 2019
Hi guys,
I'm new here so apologies if this has been covered before. I searched but didn't find anything that specifically covered this.
All things being equal. I'm getting ready to buy a Grendel upper for my Beowulf. While accuracy and distance are very important to me, I'm not looking for a range gun Primarily hunting with the ability to make long-range shots. Everything I've been able to scrape together seems to put the length at either 20" or 24". Is there anyone here who has a somewhat definitive answer on what would be better for what I want to do? The weight of 4 extra inches is not an issue. Especially since I'm also looking at a suppressor as well. Or am I sort of answering my own question? The advantage to a longer barrel is the extra time for expansion and a suppressor does that as well?
Posts: 6,193
Threads: 170
Joined: Mar 2015
600 yards are less a 20 to 16 inch will do fine on targets and with the right bullet and load will still take game out too 400 yards.
Go 24 inch if you intend to shoot at 600 yards to 1000 yards often.
Posts: 1,787
Threads: 49
Joined: Feb 2016
What's your definition of long range shots?
Posts: 7
Threads: 3
Joined: Nov 2019
@A5blster: Not often, but I do want that option. Currently the only range I have access to only goes out to 500 yards.
@Bigs28: "What's your definition of long range shots?"
If I go with a Halfcocked answer I would say a tad over a mile. ;-) However I'm likely to never be that good. So I would say hitting a target confidently at 1,000 yards.
Posts: 1,787
Threads: 49
Joined: Feb 2016
You said you didn't want a range gun. Your looking for a hunting gun and you want to hit out to 1k. If i understand you want a hunting rifle to shoot game at 1k. I would not recommend a grendel at all. As a5 said you can bang steel at 1k depending on elevation and bullet selection with any grendel over 16". Shooting an animal is a different story.
Posts: 3,654
Threads: 17
Joined: Aug 2013
If you want to hit targets 'confidently' at 1K, and optimise the Grendel for hunting then you will either satisfy one but not the other or end up with a jack of all trades, master of none. The scope you choose will also be either suited for one or the other, but not both (unless you fork out the big bucks for a 10x zoom ratio).
You are better off building two uppers with two different barrels and scopes. Or, build a hunting upper and buy a bolt gun with long range scope in a better-suited long range calibre (more case capacity/heavier bullets/higher velocity = less wind interference).
But, if you want a Jack of all trades master of none upper, and temper your expectations then 18"-20" will work. If using a suppressor you won't get more than 5 fps from free-bore boost so don't count on it helping in that regard. If you are set on a 24" barrel then how about building an 18" AR10 in Creedmore for the same weight, but more compact and closer centre-of-gravity for lugging around.
Posts: 7
Threads: 3
Joined: Nov 2019
First, thank you everyone for your great answers. A bit more info. One of the things I'm trying to do is cut down on the number of rifles I have. In a really tiny nutshell, I'm the one in my family that has to be mobile. So a Creedmore build isn't in the plan at this point. With the Beowulf/Grendel Combo I cover short-drop-anything and long range with 1.5 guns. I also have an MK47 Mutant as a good short-to-mid "light" gun.
The scope I have for it is the ATN X-Sight Pro. I've played with it on my Mutant. Ver' nice. With the bonus of night vision. Not to mention I can zero it for any weapon and save it to a profile that is only a couple clicks away. Not to mention built in ballistic computer and range estimator.
Sooo... What I'm hearing from you guys, the only reason I should go with the 24" is if I'm going to use it primarily as a range gun for target shooting. That I should just stick with the 20". I don't want to drop down to an 18" as the numbers say that one of the biggest gains is from 18 to 20. After that it's pretty incremental.
@Klen Question for you. Why do you feel that 18-20 would be Jack-of-All-Trades, master of none? Wouldn't that put it in the ideal spot for mid to _reasonable_ long range (600-800 yards)?
Posts: 3,654
Threads: 17
Joined: Aug 2013
GreyOne Wrote:@Klen Question for you. Why do you feel that 18-20 would be Jack-of-All-Trades, master of none? Wouldn't that put it in the ideal spot for mid to _reasonable_ long range (600-800 yards)?
You've shifted the goal posts...In your second post you were asking for a 1,000+ gun, that's long range. 700yds is mid range so sure, an 18" will work, especially on a still day. Now it becomes a good compromise.
Posts: 7
Threads: 3
Joined: Nov 2019
Klem Wrote:You've shifted the goal posts...In your second post you were asking for a 1,000+ gun, that's long range. 700yds is mid range so sure, an 18" will work, especially on a still day. Now it becomes a good compromise.
Hey now! ;-) You told me to temper my expectations! As I mentioned in an earlier post, true "long-range" would be a mile plus. I'm just going from what all you guys have been telling me I should temper my reasonable expectations for long-range to what the snipers in my platoon called it: 600-800 meters. If I can get that from an AR platform with minimal felt-recoil then I'm going to be happy. If, as you guys also said, I can expect it to tag steel out to 1k fairly regularly, I'm going to be even happier. I think part of the problem I was running into is I wasn't thinking of the Grendel as a "two-build" gun: 1 for short to the edge-of-long-range hunting and 1 for long-range target shooting. Your suggestion for buying two different uppers definitely has merit if I decide I really want to do the 1k plinking more seriously.
Yet again, guys, Thanks! I'm really glad Carpe Sus sent me over to you guys! https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCG6la_H...BTDtj5B-lQ
Posts: 941
Threads: 46
Joined: Sep 2016
if your going to try an hunt at longer ranges, do verify the bullet you are using will expand properly
Posts: 8,507
Threads: 241
Joined: Sep 2014
What State/region do you live/hunt in?
If you're at higher elevation, you can go with shorter barrels due to atmospheric density being less.
If you're going to suppress, I would argue against an 18" MLGS unless you get a flow-though can.
Any gas system/barrel length that has a lot of dwell time will be harder to suppress.
You have 3 different paths now:
LR TGT shooting
Hunting
Suppressed
These all steer in divergent directions if you don't set up the rifle for suppressed out of the gate.
If you do go 20", suppressing it with a TBAC Ultra 5 doesn't add a lot of weight or length to the rifle, and is really quiet.
You might consider having an 18" ILGS or RLGS upper built for you, then suppress with the TBAC Ultra 5.
Muzzle velocity is not that different between 18" and 20" in practical terms, and when you suppress it, it will give you some additional mv (not much).
If you're closer to sea level and want consistent hits at 1000yds, that's going to be a challenge that is best addressed with projectile selection and twist rate, as well as mv.
NRA Basic, Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, RSO
CCW, CQM, DM, Long Range Rifle Instructor
6.5 Grendel Reloading Handbooks & chamber brushes can be found here:
www.AR15buildbox.com
Posts: 1,397
Threads: 48
Joined: Jun 2019
If you are lugging the rifle in and out of the woods,you might opt for a 20” med contour or lighter.If you want to target shoot Benchrest or prone for accuracy,a 24” heavy barrel is what you need.There truly is no one size fits all.I have one for each type of shooting I do.And the scopes match accordingly.
|
