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+--- Thread: has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward (/showthread.php?tid=7352)
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - mccuistion - 02-19-2014
After finally getting a box of factory 123gr Hornady ammo i decided to test it. Results confirmed what has been suspected since i got the barrel.... out of 8 rounds fired the first 7 had severe case head extrusion(extractor marks) and cratered primers, on the 8th round the ejected case had a pierced primer! So i stopped right there and disassembled the rifle.
I'm trying to figure out if anyone has received a "fixed" barrel from saturn and tested it for accuracy yet? I was in contact with Lindsey at Saturn but after informing them of what happened and asking if their fix kept the chamber in SAAMI spec I have gone 6 days with no reply, and i've sent a follow-up email in that time.
I planned on sending it to PF for a proper fix but i'm torn on spending anymore money on this barrel or just getting the cheap fix, then selling it to get a safe barrel from a real company.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - customcutter - 02-19-2014
I can feel your pain. I've wanted a Grendel for about 5 years and finally got a chance at a 18" barrel in the group buy. I finally was able to measure it yesterday and got 2.255 for 123gr SST's. The factory 123 SST's are loaded to 2.245, so I've got .010 jump to the lands. Did you get SST's or Amax's? I don't know, but I think the Amax's have a slightly larger ogive. I know some company rent reamers. I don't know if you could rent one and turn the throat by hand, without using a lathe. You might ask one of the company's that rent them. Pacific Tool & Gauge is one, maybe Manson also. Google chamber reamers. I'm disappointed in Satern's response on this issue. It takes a lifetime to build a reputation, it can be ruined in 5 minutes.
Edit:
I hope you stick with the Grendel, I think it's the best thing going in an AR platform. Good luck
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - mccuistion - 02-19-2014
Received a reply, this is replying to my questions about if the throat fix will eliminate the compound throat and what the new throat dimensions will be.
"What I was informed of about the SAAMI Grendel chamber is that there is no specification for the throat. Bill Alexander had wanted the compound throat when he had introduced this chamber, and so we had decided to do the same. Since there is not a SAAMI spec for the throat, it can really be anything the reamer and barrel manufacturer want it to be. We chose Bill Alexander's throat decision.
As for reaming the throat, it won't be considered a freebore. It will still have a throat in it, but it will be the same throat as a 6.5x47 Lapua throat. I was also informed that because we are ITAR compliant, we would be in violation of their regulations if we release chamber dimensions. However, I was told you could contact PTG (who makes our reamers) and they may be able to give you that information."
On a side note, I didn't know ITAR stepped in on things like that.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - explorecaves - 02-19-2014
mccuistion Wrote:Received a reply, this is replying to my questions about if the throat fix will eliminate the compound throat and what the new throat dimensions will be.
"What I was informed of about the SAAMI Grendel chamber is that there is no specification for the throat. Bill Alexander had wanted the compound throat when he had introduced this chamber, and so we had decided to do the same. Since there is not a SAAMI spec for the throat, it can really be anything the reamer and barrel manufacturer want it to be. We chose Bill Alexander's throat decision.
As for reaming the throat, it won't be considered a freebore. It will still have a throat in it, but it will be the same throat as a 6.5x47 Lapua throat. I was also informed that because we are ITAR compliant, we would be in violation of their regulations if we release chamber dimensions. However, I was told you could contact PTG (who makes our reamers) and they may be able to give you that information."
On a side note, I didn't know ITAR stepped in on things like that.
Without a way to validate you are able to receive ITAR information, it is restricted. Better to err on the side of caution than to pay the hefty fines…
As for the throat, there is a spec for it. It is on the reamer drawing. Send them this link http://www.65grendel.com/forum/showthread.php?8080-Official-SAAMI-and-CIP-6.5-Grendel-Drawings
That statement absolutely clears things up for me. Saturn will not be getting any money from me.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - pds - 02-19-2014
mccuistion Wrote:"What I was informed of about the SAAMI Grendel chamber is that there is no specification for the throat. Bill Alexander had wanted the compound throat when he had introduced this chamber, and so we had decided to do the same. Since there is not a SAAMI spec for the throat, it can really be anything the reamer and barrel manufacturer want it to be. We chose Bill Alexander's throat decision.
mcc,
This is a pure cop-out on Saturn's part. The chamber, throat and the reamer to cut it are SAMMI specified. Get it fixed right by sending it to PF. You don't really know what you'll get if you send it back to Saturn.
pds
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - Walter - 02-19-2014
When I was at pf mark told me that he did not think you could just turn the reamer by hand. He wanted cutting fluid running through the barrel and do it in the lathe to do the fix. Send it Satern if you do not want to spend money on it.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - jluck - 02-20-2014
Am I the only one that has concluded Saturn intentionally and purposely set out to start this whole Grendel II BS? I know I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer but there defiance and arrogance of an issue smocks of intent.
I have not and will not give them a dime. I don't even want one of there older barrels, I'd feel dirty....
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - FlatsFlite - 02-20-2014
jluck Wrote:Am I the only one that has concluded Saturn intentionally and purposely set out to start this whole Grendel II BS? I know I'm not the sharpest knif in the drawer but there defiance and arrogance of an issue smocks of intent.
I have not and will not give them a dime. I don't even want one of there older barrels, I'd feel dirty....
No, I don't buy into a conspiracy theory. I think they F-ed up and don't want to drop the coin to fix it.
I'll put mine back together and fire three test rounds. Depending on the look of the brass and the size of the group will determine if it goes or stays.The ONE thing I do know for sure is that it will be my last Satern purchase not made through an authorized dealer where refunds are an option.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - arnie - 02-20-2014
I am going to fire lap mine with the Tub's kit .It should lengthen and open the throat a little .Im going to pour a cerosafe casting first and then after to see what it did . I don't know when I will be getting to this as I have other projects more important to me . Arnie
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - driven - 02-20-2014
I'm getting my modified barrel back from Satern in a couple days. They also replaced my bolt (was not a Matrix) as it was out of spec. Apparently they got a shipment of bolts that had at least some bad ones. Replacements are on order and expected this or next week.
I was getting cratered primers and one pierced in twenty rounds of factory A-max. If initial inspection of the barrel looks good I will assemble and shoot when they send me my new bolt.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - customcutter - 02-20-2014
arnie Wrote:I am going to fire lap mine with the Tub's kit .It should lengthen and open the throat a little .Im going to pour a cerosafe casting first and then after to see what it did . I don't know when I will be getting to this as I have other projects more important to me . Arnie
Just make sure you measure your casting as soon as you pull it, and write them down. My understanding is that it is not stable and will "grow" with time.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - mccuistion - 02-20-2014
So not only did they blow off responsibility on the chamber, they didn't even mention a possible bolt issue when I explained I had cratered primers and even a pierced primer...
I'm just amazed how careless they seam about this possible liability; I'm cratering primers at minimum load data and piercing factory ammo.... I'm half tempted to load some at max data and see how they react when I'm calling from the hospital with a blown up face. (not going to do this)
I don't think I want to invest anything more in this barrel. I'm going to let them cannibalize the chamber, hopefully replace the bolt and just get a Lilja or BHW barrel.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - heinz57grendel - 02-20-2014
I own a non group buy cut rifled satern barrel. It has performed great but I am limited to a 2.242 Col with factory 123 gr amax ammo. This puts me .010" from touching the lands. 2.252" has a 123 gr. Amax touching the lands. However all of my handloaded 123gr. Bullets really like a .020" jump to the lands. This worked in my favor. If I buy another barrel it will be Lilias or bartlien but I'm good as of now. After hearing what satern has said regarding short chambers I wont be trusting them to another one of my barrels.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - biggdawg - 02-20-2014
heinz57grendel Wrote:I own a non group buy cut rifled satern barrel. It has performed great but I am limited to a 2.242 Col with factory 123 gr amax ammo. This puts me .010" from touching the lands. 2.252" has a 123 gr. Amax touching the lands. However all of my handloaded 123gr. Bullets really like a .020" jump to the lands. This worked in my favor. If I buy another barrel it will be Lilias or bartlien but I'm good as of now. After hearing what satern has said regarding short chambers I wont be trusting them to another one of my barrels.
I second that ^^^
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - arnie - 02-21-2014
I have PF building me a Bartlien barrel in 6.5 Grendel 24 inch bull weight .I will be putting it on a side charger upper. I don't see how it can shoot any better than my Model 1 sales 6.5 Sporter upper but we will see .
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - dammitman - 02-21-2014
all this really is a shame for satern barrel company. the word of this is going to spread pretty far. i have also recieved bad barrel and bolt. i am glad i havent sent it back to them now as that it would be a TOTAL loss. i will send mine to PF to at least get fixed correctly. i have had 4 people i know ask me advise about grendel builds now and all ican tell them for sure is where NOT to buy a barrel from.
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - rickOshay - 02-21-2014
Didn't you read the Satern website? Its the ammo manufacturer's fault, not theirs. http://saternmachining.com
has anyone shot a "scraped/fixed" barrel yet? Torn on how to move forward - Kikn - 02-21-2014
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I laughed to my self ever so slightly.