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Which gas block for suppressor - Printable Version

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Which gas block for suppressor - Mebe007 - 02-01-2023

Hey guys, putting a can in jail this weekend. Just finalizing up my trust then off to my dealer. Currently have a tbac ultra 7 30can on hold. This will be for a 6.5 grendel AR and a 6mm arc AR. I've heard the 30 call can does better on the grendel for back pressure.

Currently my rifles have standard gas blocks with carbine length buffer tube, standard springs and standard carbine buffers. My 6mm arc is a monster 20" rifle length gas and my grendel is a monster 16" midlength gas

Now from what I can tell, I should swap out the gas blocks for adjustable to keep from being over gassed. The 2 I am looking at are the superlative and the aero. From what I can tell it seems most prefer the superlative.

Can anyone give some insight on this. Also my dealer also has the 7 in 6.5mm if that would be a better choice.[ATTACH=CONFIG]19483[/ATTACH]

Which gas block for suppressor - LRRPF52 - 02-01-2023

I have built 2 different Grendels using TBAC Ultra 5 and Ultra 7, both 30 cals for that reason.

I used tight-fitting gas blocks and Bootleg Adjustable Gas Carriers.

The most ideal configuration is a press-fit gas block that requires a jig and mechanical advantage to force the slightly undersized block onto the journal.

This is normally only possible for manufacturers where it makes sense to invest in the tooling at scale.

With the Bootleg carriers, you can dial the gas down from fully-open, to fully suppressed, with a small flathead driver right through the ejection port, no Allen wrenches and inaccessible tiny gas block screws necessary.

This is what I recommend for shooting suppressed.

Disadvantage/trade-off with the Bootleg is that you have 4 positions, versus a wide range of adjustment with a set screw system, but I haven’t needed that resolution in adjustment even with CLGS, where the port is much closer to the chamber.

Which gas block for suppressor - Mebe007 - 02-01-2023

Wouldn't it then vent excess gas out of the carrier, making it louder to the shooters ear?

Which gas block for suppressor - LRRPF52 - 02-01-2023

There’s a gas choke cylinder inside the carrier with different sized holes that regulate how much gas is allowed to flow into the expansion chamber. The choke is between the gas flow path of the carrier key and the carrier.

The Stoner internal expansion system is what initiates movement of the carrier, so when gas is choked going into that expansion chamber, it retards the carrier movement, effectively mitigating the excess back pressure from the can.

It works very well. We’ve been shooting the suppressed Grendels with the Bootleg carriers for years now, and no issues so far.

I’ve shot several cases of Hornady 123gr American Gunner when they were $139.95 for 200rds from Sportsman’s, as well as a bunch of Federal 120gr OTM, 90gr TNT, and 123gr ELD-Ms.

I usually shoot the 12” out to 800yds on steel targets at a cool range outside of Price, UT, which looks like Wile E Coyote land. Not far from Arches National Park, right near where they filmed Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade opening scene with River Phoenix for the Boy Scout horse-riding trip.

[Image: thumbnail_20181103_170524_zpsecjrrxjr.jp...fit=bounds]

[Image: a6a41af4-c3c5-4bd5-a7a1-7a11f3885b7b_zps...fit=bounds]

Which gas block for suppressor - LRRPF52 - 02-01-2023

Here’s a close-up of the carrier through the port:

[Image: 20181106_095052_zpsozoirm3f.jpg?width=59...fit=bounds]

You can see the gas regulator and its 4 positions if you look carefully.

Which gas block for suppressor - Mebe007 - 02-01-2023

Gotcha, where does the excess gas go to then? I clearly have time in this matter, but what would the carrier do that an adjustable block wouldn't, other than easier to adjust? It appears the bootleg carrier is $199 plus swapping out the bolt. This makes it much more expensive with what appears to be less adjustment. especially when outfitting 2 rifles, unless i swapped the carrier between each of them. I a sense, the carrier could get swapped with the can allowing each rifle to function normally unsuppressed, if my thinking is correct.

Which gas block for suppressor - montana - 02-01-2023

There is no best anything, as there are pros and cons with anything. That said, my favorite adj gas block is the Rifle Speed.. Maintenance is simple as it is to replace parts if and when I need to..They have different length plungers to customize individual gas systems, control knobs to fit different length hand guards and spacers..There is no need for any tool to adjust, as you adjust with your fingers..I have gotten my rifle very hot, yet I had no problem adjusting with my bare hands.. Quick and easy. The adjustment spring is on the outside, avoiding the heat internal springs types encounter and eventually fail from.. No matter what anyone claims, adj gas blocks require maintenance. With the Rifle Speed I removed the plunger, knocked the carbon off with zero issues.. The Rifle Speed gas block is in a class all its own..The negative is the cost and the required straight gas tube..

https://www.riflespeed.com/RIFLESPEED-Gas-Controls-750_p_12.html

Which gas block for suppressor - Mebe007 - 02-01-2023

montana Wrote:There is no best anything, as there are pros and cons with anything. That said, my favorite adj gas block is the Rifle Speed.. Maintenance is simple as it is to replace parts if and when I need to..They have different length plungers to customize individual gas systems, control knobs to fit different length hand guards and spacers..There is no need for any tool to adjust, as you adjust with your fingers..I have gotten my rifle very hot, yet I had no problem adjusting with my bare hands.. Quick and easy. The adjustment spring is on the outside, avoiding the heat internal springs types encounter and eventually fail from.. No matter what anyone claims, adj gas blocks require maintenance. With the Rifle Speed I removed the plunger, knocked the carbon off with zero issues.. The Rifle Speed gas block is in a class all its own..The negative is the cost and the required straight gas tube..

https://www.riflespeed.com/RIFLESPEED-Gas-Controls-750_p_12.html

I did see the rifle speed and it intrigued me. I actually saw it in a suppressor demonstration. my 20" has a 17" handguard and my 16" has a 15" handguard. Their compatibility chart doesn't show anything fitting my 16" setup. With they weren't quite so expensive.

Which gas block for suppressor - Bigs28 - 02-02-2023

The bootleg Carrier is the simplest but I like my shiny cryptic coating so I have a superlative arms in one rifle and JP adjustable gas block in another

Which gas block for suppressor - montana - 02-02-2023

Mebe007 Wrote:I did see the rifle speed and it intrigued me. I actually saw it in a suppressor demonstration. my 20" has a 17" handguard and my 16" has a 15" handguard. Their compatibility chart doesn't show anything fitting my 16" setup. With they weren't quite so expensive.

Yes, you have to use the proper length hand guard for access to the Rifle Speed as with any adj gas block..

Which gas block for suppressor - PNWTargets - 02-02-2023

If you already have rifles together you can always wait and put the can on them and change out components as needed. Every set up is different and yes any component you can adjust gas flow is nice.

Which gas block for suppressor - mtnlvr - 02-02-2023

I put the SA clamp on adj gas block on my 12" 6.5G and an 18" 5.56. My reasoning, right or wrong, was it seemed that I'd rather mitigate the excess gas before it got to the chamber. Yes, a long allen wrench helps in adjusting (ball style even better) depending on your handguard and barrel config, but I don't adjust much once I find the right setting for unsuppressed and suppressed (super and subsonic if needed).

Which gas block for suppressor - LRRPF52 - 02-02-2023

Mebe007 Wrote:Gotcha, where does the excess gas go to then? I clearly have time in this matter, but what would the carrier do that an adjustable block wouldn't, other than easier to adjust? It appears the bootleg carrier is $199 plus swapping out the bolt. This makes it much more expensive with what appears to be less adjustment. especially when outfitting 2 rifles, unless i swapped the carrier between each of them. I a sense, the carrier could get swapped with the can allowing each rifle to function normally unsuppressed, if my thinking is correct.

Excess gas vents like normal, just at a slightly slower rate.

I’ve used all kinds of adjustable gas blocks over the years and the #1 problem I’ve run into is carbon-welding.

The tiny little set screw chokes get the threads fouled with carbon, and seize up. You try to adjust them and the Allen wrench just twists and bends.

The other problem I have had is accessing them if you have a low-profile gas block under a handguard.

It sucks when doing load development because faster burning powders will work with a certain gas setting, and slower burning require another due to how the port pressure differs between powder types and charge weights.

Then there’s the temperature effect on the gas system. In really cold temps, you want to run it fully open, then choke it as the temperature gets higher.

Which gas block for suppressor - Happy2Shoot - 02-02-2023

Just wait and shoot them first.

Never change to a heavier spring.

Switch to a H3 buffer, especially if you reload. https://www.kakindustry.com/ar15-h3-carbine-buffer-red-top

Buy the absolute lightest can you can find. You can still mag dump 2 magazines just fine with the Nomad Ti. tbac ultra 7 30can looks like 10 oz. Good.

If you ever shoot it indoors with no airflow you will cry from the gas. Outdoor shooting you should be fine unless the wind is slow and in your face.

Be prepared to be disappointed with any adjustable block you buy. They all jam up, they all clog, none of them are combat reliable.

I don't shoot unsuppressed anymore so I don't unadjust my gas blocks. Problem solved.

Just my 2 cents

Which gas block for suppressor - Happy2Shoot - 02-02-2023

LRRPF52 Wrote:I have built 2 different Grendels using TBAC Ultra 5 and Ultra 7, both 30 cals for that reason.

I used tight-fitting gas blocks and Bootleg Adjustable Gas Carriers.

The most ideal configuration is a press-fit gas block that requires a jig and mechanical advantage to force the slightly undersized block onto the journal.

This is normally only possible for manufacturers where it makes sense to invest in the tooling at scale.

With the Bootleg carriers, you can dial the gas down from fully-open, to fully suppressed, with a small flathead driver right through the ejection port, no Allen wrenches and inaccessible tiny gas block screws necessary.

This is what I recommend for shooting suppressed.

Disadvantage/trade-off with the Bootleg is that you have 4 positions, versus a wide range of adjustment with a set screw system, but I haven’t needed that resolution in adjustment even with CLGS, where the port is much closer to the chamber.

Also more noise at your ear and more gas at your face.

Which gas block for suppressor - Happy2Shoot - 02-02-2023

If the gas comes down the gas tube, and you block it at the BCG it spews into your upper receiver, out your charging handle and into your eyes.

Which gas block for suppressor - Happy2Shoot - 02-02-2023

People say adjust your gas till it locks back then open one more click.

That's fine for a range toy. I would say two or three clicks.

Mostly you just want to keep the bolt from reciprocating too fast.

The BCG can go fast enough with a suppressor that your magazine can't push up the next round in time.

Or worse the BCG will close before the extracted brass can get out of the way.

Which gas block for suppressor - LRRPF52 - 02-02-2023

Happy2Shoot Wrote:If the gas comes down the gas tube, and you block it at the BCG it spews into your upper receiver, out your charging handle and into your eyes.

To me, it seemed to reduce the gas-in-your-face effects the more I choke the gas off with the regulator in the bolt carrier.

When run on position 1, it’s like a normal BCG. Fully-choked on the Suppressed position, it feels like the gas blowback is reduced.

The cyclic rate is reduced for sure.

ETA: I have come across experiences from others who say it wouldn’t cycle the action on setting 1 when unsuppressed.

That might explain why mine wouldn’t run with 90gr TNT unsuppressed, but I always planned to shoot suppressed with it.

Which gas block for suppressor - montana - 02-02-2023

One thing to remember is the more slop between the bolt's boat tail and the carrier's bolt tail bore, the more gas will be felt in the face..Suppressors will only intensify this..

Which gas block for suppressor - Mebe007 - 02-02-2023

Happy2Shoot Wrote:Just wait and shoot them first.

Never change to a heavier spring.

Switch to a H3 buffer, especially if you reload. https://www.kakindustry.com/ar15-h3-carbine-buffer-red-top

Buy the absolute lightest can you can find. You can still mag dump 2 magazines just fine with the Nomad Ti. tbac ultra 7 30can looks like 10 oz. Good.

If you ever shoot it indoors with no airflow you will cry from the gas. Outdoor shooting you should be fine unless the wind is slow and in your face.

Be prepared to be disappointed with any adjustable block you buy. They all jam up, they all clog, none of them are combat reliable.

I don't shoot unsuppressed anymore so I don't unadjust my gas blocks. Problem solved.

Just my 2 cents

i notice you are in VA, as am I. Why the recommendation to switch to an H3 buffer? im really excited to get the wait over on the can but it just started today lol. Long wait ahead.