156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever???

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - Printable Version

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156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-25-2020

...for hunting larger bodied, big game, and/or those tough pig shoulders.

In an ongoing effort to explore heavy bullets in the 6.5 Grendel to maximize hunting penetration for larger bodied game animals, today I focused on 156 grain Norma Oryx. For my ongoing bullet efforts with the 160 grain Hornady round nose, see here: http://www.65grendel.com/forum/showthread.php?22056-Loaded-160gr-Hornady-RN-today

The Oryx is a bonded gilded metal jacket, lead core bullet. It is arguably one of the finest penetrating hunting bullets ever. The Oryx will work all the way down to about 1,500 fps. With the velocity achieved in this load in my rifle that puts me out to 300 yards at my altitude, 550' ASL.

[Image: Screenshot-20200525-142559-Chronograph.jpg]

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Rifle details: AR-15, 16 inch, 1:8 twist, 3R rifling, med profile, mid-gas, melonite, free float, CProducts SS 6.5G mag with a max allowed OAL of 2.230".

USUAL DISCLAIMER: The combination of components I used worked safely in MY rifle. I am presenting the results of MY efforts to develop a load in MY rifle. YOUR rifle is not the same as MINE. Any attempt to use MY data for YOUR rifle should be worked up through the SOP for load development. There is no guarantee MY load will be safe in YOUR rifle otherwise.

Load details: 29.4gr Alliant RL17, 102% density, loaded with 7" drop tube, virgin Hornady brass, full-length sized with Hornady custom grade new dimension dies, seated to 2.243" OAL. The bullet has a max OAL of 2.247" in my chamber = about 0.005" jump to the lands in this load. Remington 7-1/2 primer. No crimp although the next go will incorporate a crimp to see if I can bring the standard deviation down some. (FWIW, if anyone has interest in a brand-new CH-4D cannelure tool I'd be willing to ship it to you for $90. Brand new, used for less than 12 bullets. It simply isn't what my Corbin tool was. It works but I much prefer the Corbin...)

Loaded round chambers fine from the magazine and extracts with a normal effort on the charging handle.

Group details: 102 lasered yards. The Chrono screenshot reflects these four rounds. The flyer in the group was my sighter, and the remaining three were fire-for-effect after adjustment. Center to center comes out at 0.167" for 3 shots. Not too shabby...

Gel Details: 101 lasered yards, Clear Gel 17"L x 6"W x 4" Thick; MV of shot #1= 2,220 fps, shot #2 = 2,217 fps, Neck before expansion = ~1 inch; Permanent cavity widest point: ~1.3"; Gel shot in a second session after the grouping proved worthy. Unfortunately in the process of taking my rifle out of the case on the tailgate of my truck I caught a bee in the eye and dropped my rifle on the deck. Unfortunately I only brought two rounds with me to do gel test. I had to shoot what I had on a gamble the scope wasn't knocked off. It was off a little and I only caught the edge of the gel and the bullet exited the side of the first block at about 12 inches, passed through 4 in of a sideways block behind the first one and stopped in the folded tarp behind the blocks. The second one was fine. It penetrated 17 inches of the first block, then 4 inches of a sideways block placed behind the first, then several layers of a folded tarp behind that. Both bullets were recovered in the tarp.

Recovered bullet details: interestingly, the maximum frontal area of each of the bullets was within 0.020" of each other. One was 0.590" and the other was 0.610". Recovered weight bullet #1= 155.1gr (loss of 0.9gr) and, bullet #2 was 155.4gr (loss of 0.6gr). Again, not too shabby...

Like my load with the 160gr Hornady RN, this load is on equal ground with the legendary 6.5x54 Mannlicher-Shönauer carbine in MV with a bullet well known in that chambering. The key to it is the incredible performance of Reloder 17. That powder is absolutely a speed demon for equal pressure in the applications its suitable for. The Swiss developed a technology to have the burn rate retardant penetrate the whole kernel of the powder, versus just a surface coating as is the norm. The result is a much flatter pressure curve with a larger area under the curve = more velocity for equal peak pressure. It is simply AMAZING in the Grendel with the heavies...

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-25-2020

And parsing out the pics because I'm limited to only posting 4 at a time????

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156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-25-2020

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156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - Mitdr774 - 05-25-2020

That is some impressive results.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - Lemonaid - 05-25-2020

Great post. There are new Grendel discoveries being made quite frequently. Don't mean to detract from your positive results but will point out a few minus points. One is having to use a drop tube, the more it's a hassle to reload the less popular it will be. Number two is demonstrated by your photo of loaded round that shows how far past the shoulder the bullet intrudes into the powder column. A common result with the long bullets or even medium with certain bullet profiles. Number three is for those who want longer range or flatter trajectory.
The minus points are on the small side, the pluses on the large. It will be interesting to see what the results on game will be, I bet it will hammer what it hits!

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-26-2020

Arrrrghhh....
Just tried to reply while using my cell phone and went to edit my long post after I posted it and I deleted the damn thing!!! That really sucks!

Anyway, @lemonade, I got to run but basically it was to say i don't mind the constructive criticism at all. Anything worth considering is worth a shakedown. It's how anything improves. As for using a drop tube, I use drop tubes whenever I'm over 100% density in order to make the powder column as consistent as possible. It's how I shoot little itty bitty tiny groups with compressed loads. Next time out, I'll try it without the drop tube. I expect it'll probably be still under half Moa.

There are a lot of great hunting bullets out there that can be launched from the Grendel. They have a range of applications from smaller Critters to longer-range for bigger animals. For my AO, things are large, typically above 160 lb and within 200 yards in thick cover. The types/velocities of bullet I've been working with in the Grendel seem to be ideally suited for my AO. For someone else in another geograph, with different game under different conditions there would be much better choices that would fit.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-26-2020

Also, much like the Ford versus Chevy versus a Dodge argument, in terminal ballistics there's the full penetration pass-through vs. The full energy dump inside the animal argument. I'm of the persuasion I'd rather have the bullet pass through and leave a good blood trail. It's worked very well for me in the manner and way I hunt. Animals still don't go very far and I found I ruin a lot less meat.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-26-2020

Oh yeah, on the length... during my work up I had some of them going 2260fps from my 16 in tube at mag length - my limiting factor being the chamber OAL. They were starting to show pressure though. Folks who run a bolt gun, esp with a chamber that will allow more OAL, and/or with a 20" or longer barrel should be able to get these handily above 2300fps with RL17.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - peak98 - 05-26-2020

Impressive load and great shooting BB.
peak98

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bruceleroy - 05-26-2020

Great job. I look forward to experimenting with stuff like this once my hunting loads are finalized.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - BluntForceTrauma - 05-26-2020

Excellent report. Great details and pix. Thanks for taking the time; it is appreciated!

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - HuntTXhogs - 05-26-2020

It could be the best bullet that cant be found in stock , anywhere....

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-26-2020

HuntTXhogs Wrote:It could be the best bullet that cant be found in stock , anywhere....

Truth be told, I had these kicking around since last fall when you could find them leading up to hunting season. I had bought them for my Creedmoor that has since moved on. For what it's worth I just called Grafs where I bought them from and they said they are on order. The kind woman said they get a shipment in from Norma about once a quarter.

Yeah, that would be a frustrating aspect of this work put into this bullet if it's something hard to get. I don't have any experience with their availability other than when I bought these.

Been giving an eyeball towards the 156gr Alaskan and Vulcan as well. Like to get my hands on some of those and give him them a whirl. Not sure they'll do any better then these or the 160 Hornady round nose. In the absence of the Norma I would give a hard look at that 160 Hornady round nose. See my posting on that as well. I wouldn't hesitate to use that for my purposes in the slightest bit.

I haven't had the opportunity to workout the accuracy aspect with the Hornady yet though. As of the load that I posted for it, it's doing 1.25 Moa at 100, as is in my rifle.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - HuntTXhogs - 05-26-2020

Id be willing to try the oryx on pigs - even though logic says it is well under utilizing the potential of the bullets design.

Not real keen on RN or others - I had contemplated the Oryx for other guns to - they seem like a nice option in full powered rifles for .50 cents a click.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - jmkhenka - 05-26-2020

You are welcome to sweden, where every gun store has atleast 10 boxes in 6.5 and .30..
Oryx is probably the most used bullet in sweden. Alaska might be more common, but mostly because hunters here is cheap and they probably have the same box since 1960.

there is a nice alternative, Woodleigh 80A or 80B. I shot the 80B (roundnose) in my grendel with a V0 of around 2150-2200.

The 80A has better BC (around .5), I would take that instead but my experience is that even in my 6.5x55 it didnt expand much when shot a moose calf at 50 meters (v0 was around 2650-2700). If the 6.5x55 cant make it work, i doubt grendel will make it more then a FMJ in those speeds.

Im going to test the roundnose on roe this fall, its that or 120 nosler BT.

Killed two roe this last week - the lack of lighter 6.5 bullets at that time forced me to use a 140 grain nosler partition. It worked, but not much expansion even though it took the shoulder.
the 120 Partition looks nice though.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - jmkhenka - 05-26-2020

Btw, Lapua mega might be an alternative? Vihtavuori has load data for that and VV powders, max v0 with N540 is around 2150.

but i have never found accuracy with N5XX powders, so im not sure about those. Perhaps Norma 203-B can work but there is no published data for that

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - Dinny - 05-26-2020

Interesting and very detailed data. What does a 150gr or 160gr bullet offer that a more common 140gr doesn't?

Thanks, Dinny

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - Mitdr774 - 05-26-2020

My guess is that the round nose bullets can probably be pushed a little faster due to eating up less case capacity than I would assume a 140gr SP would. I never got around to loading any, but my QL data had me potentially pushing a Hornady 160gr RN to 2300 FPS while staying within 6.5G limits. From what I recall I should have only been able to push a 140 SP or SST to about 2200.

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-27-2020

Dinny Wrote:Interesting and very detailed data. What does a 150gr or 160gr bullet offer that a more common 140gr doesn't?

Thanks, Dinny

For me its the sectional density and larger frontal area due to the moderate velocities I desire. Higher sectional density, at moderate velocities, with "weight forward" center of mass translates to better straight line tracking through (moderate) incidental contact with objects during flight and then through it's intended target once it gets there.

I hunt in very thick woods with large bodied animals. Up here shots are rarely as far as 200 yards and 90% of the time under a hundred. As a whole, most of the deer shot in the US are taken roughly within that same envelope. It also ruins a lot less meat.

That has been the recipe of success for generations here and it's just one of those corollaries that seems to stand the test of time. I've had discussions with folks where they admonish me for such ballistic heresy. And several times I've had to reply with recounting that millions of Buffalo were killed with very such instruments quite effectively, unfortunately. Or that I have shot a dozen deer with my bow and I've yet to have one go more than 80ish yards, and how much more damage is my "slow, heavy" bullet is doing than my arrow.

That and I like blood trails. Really good ones. The color red doesn't work so well in my eyes

156gr Oryx, best 6.5 Grendel load ever??? - bigblock - 05-27-2020

Mitdr774 Wrote:My guess is that the round nose bullets can probably be pushed a little faster due to eating up less case capacity than I would assume a 140gr SP would. I never got around to loading any, but my QL data had me potentially pushing a Hornady 160gr RN to 2300 FPS while staying within 6.5G limits. From what I recall I should have only been able to push a 140 SP or SST to about 2200.

Yes sir! And that is the other internal ballistic reason I seek that weight forward profile as well. Gives me sectional density and case volume at the same time. And my data shows the same as yours