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+--- Thread: Annealing (/showthread.php?tid=20578)
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Annealing - okiecat - 02-07-2020
Just checking to see how many reloads before you anneal your brass. Im going 2 reloads after first firing of new brass. Seems about right. Using Starline brass, hope to get 10 loadings out of it.
Annealing - A5BLASTER - 02-07-2020
I do mine after 4 firings.
Annealing - CJW - 02-07-2020
I’m using Laupa brass, I don’t anneal until the first neck cracks....
Annealing - BLUESGUNNER - 02-07-2020
After every cycle
Annealing - garyrapp55 - 02-08-2020
2-3
Annealing - LRRPF52 - 02-09-2020
There are guys on this forum with reloading experience dating to the 1970s who have never annealed Grendel brass, and have shot 20 loads through it to the point that AA or Lapua headstamps shot out, but the brass kept on going.
I have yet to anneal any Grendel brass.
I do polish my expander balls on my sizing dies so that there aren't any tool marks to form stress risers inside the necks.
With Grendel lower chamber pressures, you can get many loads without annealing even in the AR15.
Someone can do a side-by-side analysis and see if there is any benefit to annealing in Grendel if they want.
Annealing - delt475 - 02-09-2020
I guess it depends on how hot your loadings are. I run right to the max of 8208. I?m blowing primer pockets out way before I get a neck split.
Like LRRPF52, I?ve got brass that you can?t even read the identification marks on. Necks are fine, but I?m losing them due to primer pockets now.
Annealing - CJW - 02-09-2020
I don’t run any hot loads, usually I can find a midrange load that shoots great.....
My necks do split, when that starts I anneal everything.
Annealing - HuntTXhogs - 02-09-2020
Every cycle
Annealing - FLshooter - 02-10-2020
I know guys at the club who anneal after every firing.I’d say it’s overkill.I’d do every 3-4.
Annealing - lazyengineer - 02-10-2020
Don't have the rigs for anealling. I generally trash 223 brass after 3 or 4 runs, so rarely comes up as an issue there. With Grendel, I guess I'll see. When I resize 7.62x39 brass to Grendel, I don't anneal and do get split necks there after 2 or 3 cycles. I guess if I had the anealling rig, I'd probably do Grendel brass, and in particular do 7.62 converted Grendel brass. But as is, I'm finding enough Grendel and 7.62x39 boxer-brass on the ground now to build up my inventory, that my accumulation rate is higher than my loss rate, so haven't really bothered.
Annealing - LRRPF52 - 02-10-2020
delt475 Wrote:I guess it depends on how hot your loadings are. I run right to the max of 8208. I?m blowing primer pockets out way before I get a neck split.
Like LRRPF52, I?ve got brass that you can?t even read the identification marks on. Necks are fine, but I?m losing them due to primer pockets now.
I've never had primer pockets loosen up on me with Lapua or Hornady brass.
Firing Federal brass through the AR15, I've seen loose primer pockets, but even pushing loads I wouldn't in the AR15 through the Howa, those primer pockets stayed tight as long as that brass was kept in the bolt gun. I only loaded 3x on that brass IIRC though, so how long it would keep doing that would have to be covered by someone else.
The older Large Rifle Primer PPU brass (since replaced by their new line of SRP brass) would loosen up after 1 firing of factory ammo through an AR15 much of the time for me, so I never messed with it after that.
I personally have just been loading Lapua and Hornady mostly since 2009.
I have only loaded 8208XBR under 100gr and 107gr for loads I intend to duplicate.
For 120gr and above, I use slower-burning powders that have been extremely forgiving no matter the load, mainly CFE223 and LeveRevolution.
Everything is a trade-off of some kind.
Since I mostly have barrels that will shoot practically any load into tight groups, I can get away with looser SDs and ESs, which have shown up as 8" vertical stringing at 1000yds on steel, and 4" horizontal.
I could switch to a stick powder and tighten the SD significantly, but if it costs me numbers of loads per piece of brass over the long-haul, I then lose out on economy of brass life provided by Lapua especially.
Maybe there is a stick powder that will proved the same burn rate/load density and give me the same forgiving charge weight range as CFE223, but I haven't found it yet.
I'm looking at testing N540 some with the 130gr Nosler RDF through my compound throat chambers to see what it will do.
Annealing - delt475 - 02-10-2020
LRRPF52 Wrote:I've never had primer pockets loosen up on me with Lapua or Hornady brass.
Firing Federal brass through the AR15, I've seen loose primer pockets, but even pushing loads I wouldn't in the AR15 through the Howa, those primer pockets stayed tight as long as.....
There?s always a trade off between max velocity/pressure and brass life. If 28.5gr of 8208 wasn?t so accurate, I?d back it down to save the brass.
Unfortunately, 28.5 is the most accurate load I found with 123gr. I?m also fine with getting 3x-5x loadings. It greatly reduces the cost to load and I?m ok with that.
Now my Valkyrie blowing primers at 2x loading is another story. I load below max for 4895 and brass shows no signs of over pressure, except for the primer pockets. There has been a ton of well documented history of the brass being too soft.
I guess this is why I got into reloading to begin with. I wanted to shoot obscure rounds but didn?t want to pay $1+ for each pull of the trigger.
Annealing - LRRPF52 - 02-10-2020
I'm getting speeds from 16" and 18" Grendels using CFE223 that are normally what you would see from 20-24" barrels using other powders, without even pushing the max loads, and my brass comes out looking almost like I just took it out of the tumbler (unless shooting suppressed).
As long as I'm hitting steel, I don't really care whether it is .75 MOA or .5 MOA.
I know if I loaded 8208XBR I could go cut paper with tiny little bugholes at 100yds, but I honestly don't really like 100yd shooting much. It's a better day than sitting indoors, but I personally just love the satisfaction of hearing impact on steel from a light-recoiling, lightweight rifle where I can track the shot (see my own impacts). It's very satisfying to me.
Others who are looking to make ring count and x count will have a different approach maybe, while those who are primarily hunting within 200yds will have other things they are looking for.
Either way, with this cartridge, I have not seen a good argument yet for annealing, and have seen a ton of brass flow through my rifles with consistent results.
Maybe I'm missing out on yet another distraction from being able to spend time with my kids, and need to invest in additional machinery to baby my brass with.
I'd be more inclined to do it with the .260 Rem, but in the gas gun, I'm lucky to get 5 loads before primer pockets are toast, and I have to trim that brass too since the pressures are much higher and cases love to grow every firing.
Annealing - Cornbread - 02-12-2020
There are a couple of reasons you should anneal your brass. One is brass integrity, neck splits etc. You may be able to go many firings on quality brass like Lapua before you see these issues. The other is neck tension. As you resize your brass it work hardens which will change your neck tension.
Annealing - okiecat - 02-14-2020
Well thanks to all that chimed in. Very informative. Looks like several of us are on the 3-4 firing routine. To me thats plenty often, always something else to do anyway.
Annealing - LR1955 - 02-14-2020
okiecat Wrote:Just checking to see how many reloads before you anneal your brass. Im going 2 reloads after first firing of new brass. Seems about right. Using Starline brass, hope to get 10 loadings out of it.
I do not anneal the Grendel brass. 100% waste of time.
Get some Lapua Grendel brass and it will perform just as well the twentieth shot as the first.
With the Hornady brass, you will open the primer pocket before you overwork the necks.
Unless you go cheap on the sizing die. I will recommend you get a high quality sizing die with collets for the neck and that you pay attention to the expander ball to make sure it is polished and the right diameter.
That and decent case lube will be the key to long brass life.
If you are working that brass so you need to anneal it after two or four rounds fired, either your sizing die is way too small or your chamber is way too big.
LR55
Annealing - Mark611 - 02-14-2020
I have another question while were on this subject, I have a bunch of new Hornady brass that's not annealed, would u anneal this brass? before u ever processed it? I'm still kind of new on reloading for AR auto loaders, is it worth the time or not? I say this because I notice most of the 5.56 factory mil spec ammo is annealed new in the box, I know the military has its reasons for doing so! just wonder if it makes any difference? for the 6.5Grrr?
Annealing - Mark611 - 02-14-2020
I hear what ur saying LR1955, just wonder if theirs any benefit at all?
Annealing - Lemonaid - 02-14-2020
There appears to be an accuracy benefit to annealing brass, more consistent hardness and neck tension kind of thing.
Pretty good info at this link https://www.6mmbr.com/annealing.html