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+--- Thread: Two failure to fire - Any ideas? (/showthread.php?tid=17184)
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Onewolf - 10-05-2018
Background: I loaded these 6.5 Grendel rounds almost exactly 2 years ago and I haven't shot my 6.5 Grendel rifle in almost 2 years. I cleaned and lubed the upper (Precision Firearms Upper with LBC 20" barrel) before I went out to the range last weekend.
Out of about 30 rounds I had 2 FTF. I've never had that issue with this rifle.
They were my standard load: Alexander Arms brass, 28.0 gr 8208 XBR, Lapua Scenar 123, CCI 450 primers.
I haven't (knowingly) altered anything with the rifle since I last shot it.
The FTF primers (2 left) have convex dimples, the example good brass/primers have the normal firing pin mark.
Any theories?
Thanks.
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Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - A5BLASTER - 10-05-2018
Hard for me to tell but looks like the fireing pin jyst didn't strike it hard and deep enough.
Maybe something to do with the trigger/hammer springs sitting up for so long.
Maybe some trash in the fireing pin channel?
Take the bcg apart and give it a good cleaning and check see if any trash in the lower around the trigger and hammer, might be as simple as that.
Hope you figure it out.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - rabiddawg - 10-06-2018
Obvious case of a Grendel getting even with its owner for lack of use.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Lastrites - 10-07-2018
Besides a cleaning anc checking spring orientation I'd measure the FP protrusion.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - LR1955 - 10-07-2018
A5BLASTER Wrote:Hard for me to tell but looks like the fireing pin jyst didn't strike it hard and deep enough.
Maybe something to do with the trigger/hammer springs sitting up for so long.
Maybe some trash in the fireing pin channel?
Take the bcg apart and give it a good cleaning and check see if any trash in the lower around the trigger and hammer, might be as simple as that.
Hope you figure it out.
Not hard for me to tell.
Light primer strikes is exactly correct.
I doubt it is crud in the firing pin hole but could be crud in other places.
Suggestion.
Take upper from lower.
Hose out lower with brake cleaner and lube trigger parts again.
Remove bolt from carrier and clean both. Lube as necessary.
Put back together and my bet is the problem will be solved.
LR55
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Popeye212 - 10-07-2018
What trigger is in it. Stopped using 450's in my .223 they are to thick for it.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Onewolf - 10-09-2018
Popeye212 Wrote:What trigger is in it. Stopped using 450's in my .223 they are to thick for it.
Geissele SSA-E
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Onewolf - 10-09-2018
I 100% thoroughly cleaned the chamber and redid (clean/lube) the bolt carrier group and I went back to the range on Sunday with one magazine with just the two FTF rounds. Both rounds again FTF. I also had three 10 round magazines from the same loading batch and all 30 fired no problem.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - LR1955 - 10-09-2018
Onewolf Wrote:I 100% thoroughly cleaned the chamber and redid (clean/lube) the bolt carrier group and I went back to the range on Sunday with one magazine with just the two FTF rounds. Both rounds again FTF. I also had three 10 round magazines from the same loading batch and all 30 fired no problem.
You eliminated mechanical issues by this test. Since you tried to fire them again and they didn't fire, yet all others you tried did fire, chalk it up to the primers in those two rounds.
Reasons are generally that they are seated too deeply and or lube got into them somehow. I doubt it is the lube and they appear to be light strikes so maybe seated too deeply?
LR55
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - NugginFutz - 10-09-2018
I've only every had a single fail to ignite on a factory center-fire round, which was a Hornady A.G. 123 gr BTHP. Definitely caught me by surprise.
I took it home, pulled the bullet and confirmed that A) I had powder and B) the primer had not ignited.
I decapped that round and examined the primer under magnification. Compared to one of my Remington's, it appeared to be a defective primer, missing the lead styphnate (or whatever chemical is used in their primers).
Never had that happen before, even in my own reloading.
Either way, if you're truly interested enough, carefully breakdown those rounds and seat the primers into another case (preferrably in a different caliber / chambering).
Test fire only the primer in a different weapon. You'll have your answer.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Popeye212 - 10-09-2018
I just had a FF with CCI450 today and it definitely was hit hard enough BOTH times. Trigger was Larue MBT so not the trigger and check my cases with an L.E. Wilson case gauge.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Klem - 10-09-2018
Popeye212 Wrote:I just had a FF with CCI450 today and it definitely was hit hard enough BOTH times. Trigger was Larue MBT so not the trigger and check my cases with an L.E. Wilson case gauge.
Popeye,
I would be careful not to throw out the baby with the bathwater with your 450's...Occasionally primers don't go off. When you shoot bulk just expect it to happen every once in a while. Factory or hand-loads, it makes no difference. Sometimes one will fail to fire, and sometimes it goes off on the second firing. Like in the movie, Man on Fire where the bullet 'always tells the truth' (of course it does!)... They're just hamming-up the phenomenon of the occasional dud primer.
Here's a factory 223 round that misfired a while ago. It's still sitting in the top of my gun safe waiting to get looked at. I don't have a clue what brand of primer they used and given all the rest in the batch are fine I am not losing any sleep over it. I kept it in case any of the others misfired and I guess also because it's a rare event.
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Apart from dirty guns, ultra light triggers or the spraying of WD40 anywhere near your reloading bench (WD40 is a primer killer) then it's probably just that one in a few thousand that just doesn't work.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Popeye212 - 10-10-2018
Klem no worries I'm not throwing any babies out...
This is not the first time, had one WSR do the same thing in the .223 a couple of weeks ago. Kind of disinclined to throw out the 600 left. So that means at least 400 were good. I will contact CCI and see if they will do anything. I won't use them with a drop in trigger though.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Klem - 10-10-2018
Popeye212 Wrote:Klem no worries I'm not throwing any babies out...
If you won't use them with a drop-in trigger that's what I mean by throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Plus contacting the manufacturer when one primer doesn't go off. By all means do what you have to but unless it's a batch on them not going off I can almost write their polite response myself.
Thousands of 450's get fired with drop-in triggers every week/month without issue...
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Frontier Gear - 10-10-2018
Klem Wrote:(WD40 is a primer killer)
Yep, my brother reloaded a bunch of .357 rounds at my dad's house. That's also where my dad kept his can of WD40. Most of those primers failed. I don't know if my brother decided to use the WD40 as a case lube or what, but it definitely got in there somehow. I have heard that certain case lubes could cause primer failures, but I don't know if that is true or not.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Popeye212 - 10-10-2018
Klem with the information I have seen and read, more than one drop in trigger has had issues with light strikes including Timney by an owner. It is well documented and I have also seen more than one recommendation not to use them in certain applications. I won't name them it is not necessary. Will I continue to use them yes. In my Sport with the drop in NO. I have about 700 GM205M's that will do nicely. Will I contact CCI, probably. They might give me some more of em.
. Feel free to write their response if you feel the need. Cheers Buddy
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Klem - 10-10-2018
Popeye212 Wrote:Klem with the information I have seen and read, more than one drop in trigger has had issues with light strikes including Timney by an owner. It is well documented and I have also seen more than one recommendation not to use them in certain applications. I won't name them it is not necessary. Will I continue to use them yes. In my Sport with the drop in NO. I have about 700 GM205M's that will do nicely. Will I contact CCI, probably. They might give me some more of em.
Like I said, 'you do what you have to'.
I'm off to load up some 450's and forget about this thread.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - Popeye212 - 10-11-2018
Klem Wrote:Like I said, 'you do what you have to'.
I'm off to load up some 450's and forget about this thread.
Same here as a matter of fact about to prime 50 more 450,s and try the Lapua 123's again. Good Luck and good shooting and may they all go in the same hole.
Two failure to fire - Any ideas? - PrecisionFirearms - 10-16-2018
We use Literally 200K 450 primers every year and rarely have a problem with them. Id say the failure rate is about .0001%. Check your storage method? or the storage method of the vendor.