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+--- Thread: SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems (/showthread.php?tid=13279)
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - LRRPF52 - 04-26-2017
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/04/24/socom-looks-6-5mm-creedmoor-260-remington-new-semiautomatic-sniper-rifle/
Quote:Special Operations Command is exploring a new caliber for its semi-automatic sniper rifle needs and upgrading one of its bolt-action sniper rifle systems.
Maj. Aron Hauquitz told Military Times Tuesday that SOCOM is in the preliminary stages of exploring a sniper rifle chambered in the 6.5 mm caliber. The two commercially available rounds being evaluated are the .260 Remington and the 6.5 mm Creedmoor.
Research shows that both rounds will stay supersonic longer, have less wind drift and better terminal performance than 7.62 mm ammunition, SOCOM officials said.
Hauquitz said that the research is focused on the popularity and availability of the cartridge, and finding out the benefits and drawbacks of the different rounds.
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - Kilco - 04-27-2017
Interesting. I've only ever used a 260 Rem in the AR10 platform.. I remember when Hornady first advertised the 6.5 Creedmoor, one of the big pushes were it's disign was with semi-autos in mind.. I understand the shorter case would make performance tuning a little easier, but wouldn't the longer, less steep shoulder on the 260 Rem make it a more reliable feeding cartridge?
I've always been a 260 rem guy, never saw the need for a Creedmoor, but the amount of popularity it has brought to the .264 class as a whole is unsurpassed..
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - LRRPF52 - 04-28-2017
6.5 Creedmoor is a much better-designed case than .260 Rem, which is just a .308 wildcat that gained SAAMI standardization like 7mm-08 and .243 Winchester.
6.5 Creedmoor is a necked down 30 TC, which never caught on, but has several design features that are superior to the .308 Winchester with regard to neck tension, shoulder geometry, and projectile base location to the shoulder-neck junction.
I like the .260 Rem also, and have had 2 of them in gas guns. I still have my GA Precision 22" .260 Rem., which is a laser.
I found that it adds anywhere from 175yds to 225yds over a 22" Grendel shooting the same bullets, both of which are supersonic past 1000yds easily, especially with 130gr VLD.
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - stanc - 04-28-2017
Kilco Wrote:Interesting. I've only ever used a 260 Rem in the AR10 platform.. I remember when Hornady first advertised the 6.5 Creedmoor, one of the big pushes were it's disign was with semi-autos in mind.. I understand the shorter case would make performance tuning a little easier, but wouldn't the longer, less steep shoulder on the 260 Rem make it a more reliable feeding cartridge?Perhaps. 7.62 NATO development initially used a 30-degree shoulder (3-7 below), but it was later changed to 20 degrees (8-13) due to concerns about feeding and chambering.
![[Image: IMG_0125L.jpg]](http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/IMG_0125L.jpg)
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - sharky47 - 11-03-2017
They are looking at belt feds as well.
Here is a 260 Rem MK48 barrel I made a couple years ago for US MGA, runs good - just stupid expensive to feed with current ammunition choices.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHxUUhb_KO8
Just finished an M240 barrel in 260 Rem as well, don't think the customer has test fired it yet though....
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - HowaGrendel - 11-03-2017
260 and 6.5 are basically the same....why test 2 rounds that are basically identical.....
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - LRRPF52 - 11-03-2017
HowaGrendel Wrote:260 and 6.5 are basically the same....why test 2 rounds that are basically identical.....To measure feeding reliability in both belt and magazine-fed weapons to see if there's a statistical difference.
Also to test accuracy potential in the mag-fed Sniper Systems.
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - Kilco - 11-03-2017
LRRPF52 Wrote:To measure feeding reliability in both belt and magazine-fed weapons to see if there's a statistical difference.
Also to test accuracy potential in the mag-fed Sniper Systems.
I'm my gas guns the 260 Rem always fed better. Where you run into issues is chasing the lands. Creedmoor doesn't suffer from that as much with the shorter case.
I've owned many of both, and still prefer the 260 Rem.
Alot of guys claim the creedmoor is a better designed case, and mathmaticaly it very well might be. But when the rubber meets the road I've been able to squeeze another 50-75 fps from the 260 with less pressure signs, and every 260 I've owned, wether factory or custom has been every bit as accurate as an equivalent creedmoor.
I've been playing with two 6mm Creedmoors, and the same thing holds true vs the 243 Win.
I don't get better velocity with the 243v6mmCM as I do 260vs6.5CM, but I've yet to find a single thing the 6mm CM can do a 243 Win can't.
Only pro I've found with 6mmCM is that factory chambered rifles are using the 1:7.7 or 1:8 twist, allowing the use of the high b.c 6mm projectiles, where factory 243 chambered rifles are typically 1:9-1:10.
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - bj139 - 11-04-2017
Kilco,
Since you mentioned 243 Win I thought I would mention Bear Creek Arsenal has 243 Win uppers for $399 in the AR-10 format.
I am tempted since I always wanted a 243 win.
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - Kilco - 11-04-2017
bj139 Wrote:Kilco,
Since you mentioned 243 Win I thought I would mention Bear Creek Arsenal has 243 Win uppers for $399 in the AR-10 format.
I am tempted since I always wanted a 243 win.
I'm a big fan of the 243 Win. 3 years ago I bagged a 207lbs whitetail with a 243 at 200 yards using the 95gr SST.
That's a smoking deal for an AR10 upper.. what twist rate?
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - grayfox - 11-10-2017
From the website: $399.99
BCA AR-10 Complete Upper Assembly, 20" Parkerized 4150 Steel Heavy Barrel, .243 Winchester, 1:8 Twist, Rifle Length Gas System w/ 15" Lightweight Keymod Rail
wt: 4 lb.
SKU: UA243RHB2018(P)-(15)LWKM
20" 4150 Parkerized Barrel w/ 1:8 Twist
SHeavy Barrel Profile
15" Lightweight Keymod
.243 Caliber
M4 Flat Top Upper Receiver [Note, it says AR-10 feed ramps]
Rifle Length Gas System,
BCA Standard BCG
Charging Handle
Bird Cage Flash Hider
Isn't the rub with 243's throat erosion / barrel burn out?
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - Kilco - 11-10-2017
Personally I'd want at least a 22" with a 243 or 6mm CM to take advantage of the cartridges potential.
I read some reports that the 6mmCM has slightly better throat life than the 243, but I feel like that is so subjective to how you load/shoot your rifle..
I have a 243 Win R700 with over 2k rounds down the barrel that still shoots sub moa and produces great velocity.. I've never shot it in rapid succession, and keep my load at or below book max.
Alot of the barrel life numbers come from competition shooters who really push the limits with thier handloads and can fire alot of rounds in a relatively short period of time.
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - SHORT-N-SASSY - 12-24-2017
![[Image: 6.5_SOCOM.png]](https://s14.postimg.org/vo0abt7tt/6.5_SOCOM.png)
(http://www.gunsholstersandgear.com/2017/11/30/new-cartridge-6-5-socom/)
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - Forrest - 01-22-2018
LRRPF52 Wrote:6.5 Creedmoor is a much better-designed case than .260 Rem, which is just a .308 wildcat that gained SAAMI standardization like 7mm-08 and .243 Winchester.
6.5 Creedmoor is a necked down 30 TC, which never caught on, but has several design features that are superior to the .308 Winchester with regard to neck tension, shoulder geometry, and projectile base location to the shoulder-neck junction.
I like the .260 Rem also, and have had 2 of them in gas guns. I still have my GA Precision 22" .260 Rem., which is a laser.
I found that it adds anywhere from 175yds to 225yds over a 22" Grendel shooting the same bullets, both of which are supersonic past 1000yds easily, especially with 130gr VLD.
How do you feel the 6.5 x 47 stacks up in case design and performance. Is it politics holding it back?
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - SHORT-N-SASSY - 01-24-2018
The 6.5mm Creedmoor in the Desert Tech MDR, with free-floating barrel:
![[Image: Creed_A.png]](https://s18.postimg.org/sey86tix5/Creed_A.png)
![[Image: Creed)B.png]](https://s18.postimg.org/6frtjn4nt/Creed)B.png)
(http://bullpupforum.com/index.php?topic=12711.msg135417#msg135417)
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
ETA:
![[Image: 6.5mm_Barrels.png]](https://s18.postimg.org/wt6pik6bd/6.5mm_Barrels.png)
(http://www.es-tactical.com/shop/Desert-Tech/ES-Tactical-MDR-Barrels--Conversion-Kits/p/65mm-Barrels-x32052649.htm)
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - sierracharlie338 - 01-25-2018
Forrest Wrote:How do you feel the 6.5 x 47 stacks up in case design and performance. Is it politics holding it back?
For arguments sake they are all three basically the same. In terms of performance (terminal and ballistic) it comes down to personal preference and if you reload or not.
6.5x47 - reload only
260 - reload and some ammo but expensive
65CM - excellent ammo backed by a major ammo company that is more affordable than the 260.
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - stanc - 01-26-2018
SHORT-N-SASSY Wrote:If anybody is at SHOT, please see if you can get any info/pics of PCP Ammo's new 6.5 SOCOM cartridge.
http://www.gunsholstersandgear.com/2017/11/30/new-cartridge-6-5-socom/
![[Image: 6.5-SOCOM-Cartridge.jpg?resize=480%2C310]](https://i1.wp.com/www.gunsholstersandgear.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/6.5-SOCOM-Cartridge.jpg?resize=480%2C310)
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - SHORT-N-SASSY - 01-26-2018
![[Image: PCP_A.png]](https://s18.postimg.org/df2nr81pl/PCP_A.png)
![[Image: PCP_B.png]](https://s18.postimg.org/sb16yw5fd/PCP_B.png)
(https://n2a.goexposoftware.com/events/ss18/goExpo/floorPlan/viewFloorPlan.php?ei=34&zb=3727)
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
ETA:
![[Image: PCP_C.png]](https://s18.postimg.org/9zf4vn6s9/PCP_C.png)
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=40&v=frA6anAX8wk)
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - SHORT-N-SASSY - 01-31-2018
![[Image: Story.png]](https://s18.postimg.org/mnbxs9hyx/Story.png)
(https://www.pcpammo.com/about-2/)
![[Image: questions.png]](https://s18.postimg.org/6p38265rd/questions.png)
(https://www.pcpammo.com/faq/)
SOCOM Looking at .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor Sniper Systems - BaltTigger - 01-31-2018
6.5 Creedmoor and .260 Remington are ballistically the same. The only difference is the .260 has a tiny bit more case capacity. They functionally shoot the same bullet at the same speed.
Whichever ammo is available to you at the lowest price is the one to go for. Right now the Creedmoor is the darling and ammo is more readily available here than .260. YMMV