Sputnik Wrote:Wasn't there concerns on the sniper forum of the Hogue pillar bedded stocks being to flexible and that in many applications the stock bent enough to touch the barrel? Or has Hogue fixed this? Are there better options, especially with the heavy barrel?

kmon Wrote:I have heard that concern, having used a Hogue stock on Remington 700s in 7mmSTW and 350 Remington Mag, I really don't have concerns with the Hogue stocks especially with no more recoil than a Grendel generates. Just from torqueing the STW into the Hogue groups shrank in half what they were in the factory Tupperware stock.

adamjp Wrote:For those who don't know much about Howa.

A reasonably old Japanese firearms manufacturer (well as old as they can be after the B29 remodelling of Japanese industry in 1944/45) that have made their Howa rifle since the early 1970s. Contrary to some American opinions, they are not modelled off a Remington 700, but a Sako L579. They have adopted Remington 700 base configurations so two piece bases are very common and fit nicely. They have been sold in the USA as the Smith and Wesson 1500, spent some time as a Mossberg IIRC and are now the barrelled action that Weatherby sells as Vanguard.

They are a forged action. Finished on full CNC machinery and my work with them has indicated that the usual tricks for accurising Remington 700s do not apply. They leave the factory straight and true, so correct that swapping barrels usually headspace up within tolerance. The barrels are also fitted with CNC - getting one undone is almost impossible and a relief cut is needed just forward of the action to release the pressure generated by the joint.

Barrel thread is 26x1.5mm, which is almost, but not quite the same as the Remington 700. All other threads are metric (except the scope mount holes which are the standard 6-48).

Triggers are good, the new 2 stage is well regarded and easily tuneable. Such that there is a local gent commonly known as the 'eBay trigger guy' who makes a useful sideline in tuning triggers for guys down to 1lb safe release weight.

Extractors are really good (again modelled off the Sako 579) and I have never needed to replace/repair an extractor on a Howa (unless lost by the owner). Ejectors are the usual plunger ejector.

The only two criticisms of the Howa rifles are that they are a relatively heavy action. Comparable to a Ruger, and a few ounces heavier than a Remington 700. The other criticism is that some feel that the barrels are a little soft, wearing out faster than they probably should.

The rifle is immensely popular in Australia/New Zealand and have been sold here for at least the last 30 years. They work, and keep on working despite poor maintenance. Think of them as a flat bottomed Rem 700, or a push feed Model 70. Except that they are square from the factory.

One in 6.5 Grendel will not be the lightest possible rifle, but it would have all the genetics for being accurate.



My last comment on the Howa rifles is that some may recognise the other rifle that Howa commonly produces. It has 9 lugs, massive bolt and Uncle Roy designed it for his own cartridges (which if you haven't worked it out yet have a trademarked double radius shoulder). Production of the entire rifle moved to Howa in 1970.

Sputnik Wrote:Thanks adamjp, Great information. Would the Stainless Steel option mitigate the soft barrel issue? What would your assessment be of a 24 inch SS heavy barrel fluted, cerakoted, target crowned setup on a Hogue black stock be for a Grendel? Much like the Varmint option. Would a stiffer stock be better? Looking for the best accuracy for target and longer ranges. Weight not a particular concern. Nice companion for my PF Neptune V. Nice Youtube video provided by Dave Bob, thanks.

adamjp Wrote:To be honest. Buy one, shoot it lots and when the barrel wears out at 4000 rounds put another one in.

The rumour of soft barrels may well have come from professional kangaroo cullers who will work their way through a 223 barrel in a few months. It's not hard when you can fire upwards of 100 rounds a night, for weeks on end. Many of the older blokes in this trade are coming from Sako 461 rifles and the accuracy need is quite high - since 1986 the code for kangaroo culling requires brain shots only. Most ranges are at 80 to 120m, but kangaroos are small brained animals (something quite evident when you spend time in the bush with them). Kangaroo cullers are the only blokes I know who have shot out the ACTION on a 461 - simply worn it out through use and fatigue. More than a few barrels had been fitted to that rifle over it's life.

As for stocks. Those Hogue stocks are complete rubbish. No action will work to it's best in such a flexible product as the Hogue. I am sure that a quality stock from McMillan, Manners, MPI, etc. will be quickly available. Hell, even a Boyds laminate will be better than a Hogue pillar bedded stock.

adamjp Wrote:For those who don't know much about Howa.

A reasonably old Japanese firearms manufacturer (well as old as they can be after the B29 remodelling of Japanese industry in 1944/45) that have made their Howa rifle since the early 1970s. Contrary to some American opinions, they are not modelled off a Remington 700, but a Sako L579. They have adopted Remington 700 base configurations so two piece bases are very common and fit nicely. They have been sold in the USA as the Smith and Wesson 1500, spent some time as a Mossberg IIRC and are now the barrelled action that Weatherby sells as Vanguard.

They are a forged action. Finished on full CNC machinery and my work with them has indicated that the usual tricks for accurising Remington 700s do not apply. They leave the factory straight and true, so correct that swapping barrels usually headspace up within tolerance. The barrels are also fitted with CNC - getting one undone is almost impossible and a relief cut is needed just forward of the action to release the pressure generated by the joint.

Barrel thread is 26x1.5mm, which is almost, but not quite the same as the Remington 700. All other threads are metric (except the scope mount holes which are the standard 6-48).

Triggers are good, the new 2 stage is well regarded and easily tuneable. Such that there is a local gent commonly known as the 'eBay trigger guy' who makes a useful sideline in tuning triggers for guys down to 1lb safe release weight.

Extractors are really good (again modelled off the Sako 579) and I have never needed to replace/repair an extractor on a Howa (unless lost by the owner). Ejectors are the usual plunger ejector.

The only two criticisms of the Howa rifles are that they are a relatively heavy action. Comparable to a Ruger, and a few ounces heavier than a Remington 700. The other criticism is that some feel that the barrels are a little soft, wearing out faster than they probably should.

The rifle is immensely popular in Australia/New Zealand and have been sold here for at least the last 30 years. They work, and keep on working despite poor maintenance. Think of them as a flat bottomed Rem 700, or a push feed Model 70. Except that they are square from the factory.

One in 6.5 Grendel will not be the lightest possible rifle, but it would have all the genetics for being accurate.



My last comment on the Howa rifles is that some may recognise the other rifle that Howa commonly produces. It has 9 lugs, massive bolt and Uncle Roy designed it for his own cartridges (which if you haven't worked it out yet have a trademarked double radius shoulder). Production of the entire rifle moved to Howa in 1970.

81police Wrote:any updates on this y'all?

Quote:Yes, we are considering 6.5 Grendel as an additional caliber. Perhaps later this year if all goes well with development.

Rick Homme
Director of Marketing and Advertising
Legacy Sports International, Inc.