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+--- Thread: 20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper (/showthread.php?tid=18638)
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - FANGGHOSTWOLF - 04-05-2019
Hollis Wrote:FANGHOSTWOLF: Are you sure about the nitrate finish only. I thought the nitrate process doesn't allow for a finish - it is a bath that completely modifies the molecular structure. I'm not sure how you can "finish" only the outside of the barrel and not also treat the bore. I chose the 4150 nitrate model over the stainless since my research indicated that the 4150 is significantly more durable and questionable regarding accuracy inferiority as compared to the chrome line (and I think it also compared it to stainless, but I'll have to go back and check).
I asked the question regarding nitrate 'finish" to BCA customer service, but I'm not impressed with their customer service and doubt I'll get a reply unless I put it in the review section. They monitor that section and quickly address any potential negative remarks. After I take it to the range and get some feedback on accuracy, I'll do a review and ask this question and see what they say.
Late to the show. Per BCA NOT. OD only? Thought the same. Reason I did not ream the chamber 0n my 20". Went 24" 416R. At 20" dressed out still a bench gun for me. I'll take the extra 4" and SS.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Hollis - 04-06-2019
Fangghostwolf:
You are correct regarding the BCA nitride barrels. Customer service confirmed this today:
<<We apologize for the delay. We only coat outside the barrel, we do not do anything on the inside. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.
Customer Service>>
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Hollis - 04-06-2019
I had some extra time today so I went out to the range again to see if somehow my new BCA Grendel would settle down and shoot accurately. I also was able to get my hands on some Hornady SST, which I hear is better than the Hornady Black. The final result is that I can shoot my Radical Firearms 7.62x39 upper with Red Army (cheap stuff!) ammo with much tighter groups than I can with my BCA 6.5 Grendel. Since the only reason I purchased the Grendel upper was to allow me to shoot out beyond 400 yards with my AR, I am very disappointed. I sent a message to BCA customer service today. Let's see how they handle this. I'll keep you updated.
Bottom line though is that it was not worth the risk of buying BCA. I spent much more on ammo testing this thing hoping to get decent groups than the money I "saved" by purchasing a lower priced upper. Sometimes I luck out and get more for my money with "bargain deals," but, more often than not, it ends up costing more in the long run.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Chipj4 - 04-06-2019
CaptnC Wrote:Is it just me, but it doesn't seem very many here have much luck getting Hornady's Black ammo to shoot very good.
I've only shot two boxes of their ELD-M and it was about 1.5" groups. While reloads have all been much better.
This has been my experience with shooting it out of an Odin 18". I can get around a 1.25-1.50 group with HBlack but get under 1" all the (not every) time with reloads using other brand bullets. I can't really get the ELDs to shoot consistently well in hand loads either. I have just 12 rounds through my Howa so it is too early to tell but it does seem like it might shoot the ELDs well.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Chipj4 - 04-06-2019
There seems to be enough other lower priced options out there to take any chances with BCA. Has anyone done a comparison of budget barrels? Like say AR Stoner, Radical, or Anderson? Or, are they in a different class?
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Hollis - 04-07-2019
So what is the process for BCA when a barrel is returned for inaccuracy? Do they typically replace the barrel or what? Any info on this would be very helpful.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - BCHunter - 04-07-2019
Chipj4 Wrote:There seems to be enough other lower priced options out there to take any chances with BCA. Has anyone done a comparison of budget barrels? Like say AR Stoner, Radical, or Anderson? Or, are they in a different class?
The problem is many of the cheap uppers have barrel sourced from other companies, which aren't disclosed the Ar Stoners are thought to be BCA sourced barrels .
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Chipj4 - 04-07-2019
BCHunter Wrote:The problem is many of the cheap uppers have barrel sourced from other companies, which aren't disclosed the Ar Stoners are thought to be BCA sourced barrels .
I guess there really is no free lunch in this department.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Jeepster18_88 - 04-07-2019
I spent a little more and bought a Diamondback but it also came with a free magazine. It shoots much better than the BCA but it still doesn't like the SST. My BCA shot over 12" with a 9 shot group (couldn't find one because it missed the backer completely). I put the same scope on the Diamondback and it shoots good with the ELD-M and wolf but the SST shot around 8". There's something about this particular load that is out of wack. I'm not sure if it's a different powder or not, but I've never seen any load by any manufacturer that shot this bad. I'm really wondering if the heat treat process is the problem with the BCA barrels because my cold shot from every load was bullseye. If I allowed a 10-20 minutes between shots, it appears that I might have had tight groups because the BCA had about 12 cold shots. Everything after were flyers. The Diamondback didn't have that issue, it just didn't like the SST load.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Hollis - 04-08-2019
I have a Radical Firearms lower that I bought together with a 7.52x39 upper. It was a great deal. It shoots great with just about anything I stuff in it. (See video when it was brand new shooting Wolf: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yXp38pPB10&t=30s). I took it out to 400 yards and was able to ring 10" and 12" steel target consistently out to 375 yards and still get 2 out of 4 at 400 yards (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8JY79gdS8Y&t=85s) with Monarch ammo. Since this was my first AR and I was using the cheapest scope imaginable, I thought this was typical. I then get a 6.5 Grendel to shoot accurately out to much further distances only to get 8" groups at 100 yards with the BCA upper. I wanted to get a Radical Firearms Grendel upper, but they are very pricey. I have been very pleased with Radical Firearms and how well I have been treated by customer service, but couldn't justify paying more for the 6.5 Grendel upper than I did for my complete 7.62x39 upper and lower.
If I was wanting accuracy, I probably should have saved up and bought something more trustworthy. I was hoping I'd be one of the lucky ones who brag about their BCA upper shooting sub MOA from the get go. I just hope BCA customer service can fix my problem to allow me to get an accurate longer range AR without having to dish out more bucks.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - A5BLASTER - 04-08-2019
Hollis Wrote:I have a Radical Firearms lower that I bought together with a 7.52x39 upper. It was a great deal. It shoots great with just about anything I stuff in it. (See video when it was brand new shooting Wolf: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yXp38pPB10&t=30s). I took it out to 400 yards and was able to ring 10" and 12" steel target consistently out to 375 yards and still get 2 out of 4 at 400 yards (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8JY79gdS8Y&t=85s) with Monarch ammo. Since this was my first AR and I was using the cheapest scope imaginable, I thought this was typical. I then get a 6.5 Grendel to shoot accurately out to much further distances only to get 8" groups at 100 yards with the BCA upper. I wanted to get a Radical Firearms Grendel upper, but they are very pricey. I have been very pleased with Radical Firearms and how well I have been treated by customer service, but couldn't justify paying more for the 6.5 Grendel upper than I did for my complete 7.62x39 upper and lower.
If I was wanting accuracy, I probably should have saved up and bought something more trustworthy. I was hoping I'd be one of the lucky ones who brag about their BCA upper shooting sub MOA from the get go. I just hope BCA customer service can fix my problem to allow me to get an accurate longer range AR without having to dish out more bucks.
Don't waist your time and effort. Just buy a group buy barrel off of here and change out the barrels, reassemble and move on. It will shoot much better and be cheaper and less hassle in the long run.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Hollis - 04-08-2019
I'm a bit confused about the "group buy barrel". Could you tell me more?
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Hollis - 04-08-2019
I received email first thing this in the morning from BCA with UPS label to send the upper back in for inspection. That was very quick response from customer service, but the bad news is that they say there is a 4 week turnaround expected. I sent it in but it looks like I won't be able to take this with me when I go shooting over Easter break. Hope they fix it the first time around.
I saw other posts about BCA switching out barrels on returns. I'm going to try to switch out my Nitride barrel for one that is stainless steel now that I know that the Nitride is just on the outside and not the bore.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - grayfox - 04-08-2019
Hollis Wrote:I'm a bit confused about the "group buy barrel". Could you tell me more?
Scroll down on the first page to the Equipment Exchange Section, there are threads about several barrels offered up as "group buys" - BFT in his excellent up-front marketeering has produced some darn good offerings for the horde.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Wanderson - 04-09-2019
Hollis Wrote:Fangghostwolf:
You are correct regarding the BCA nitride barrels. Customer service confirmed this today:
<<We apologize for the delay. We only coat outside the barrel, we do not do anything on the inside. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.
Customer Service>>
Is it just me, or is this the dumbest thing ever?
Why would you go to the trouble to just nitride the outside of a barrel?
I don’t care what it looks like, I want the bore nitrided for longer service life.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Jakegsxr11 - 04-09-2019
I'm no expert but I'm not even sure it is feasible to only nitride the outside of the barrel. Both ends would need to be completely sealed to avoid the process occurring inside, thus adding unnecessary cost.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Hollis - 04-09-2019
Jakegsxr11 Wrote:I'm no expert but I'm not even sure it is feasible to only nitride the outside of the barrel. Both ends would need to be completely sealed to avoid the process occurring inside, thus adding unnecessary cost.
Exactly. That is why I was so puzzled when Fangghostwolf said that they only Nitride treated the outside. I'm still confused about this, but after what I have learned now, I wish I would have ordered the stainless steel barrel. I wanted nitrided barrel since they last longer than stainless steel and are less sensitive to heat. But that is only if the bore is nitrided. I'll ask BCA if I can swap for stainless steel if they determine that my barrel needs to be replaced to obtain 1 MOA.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - poldo - 04-09-2019
I am so happy with my BCA 20" SS , bought the complete upper form them
I had some initial problems with cycling steel wolf ammo then realized the gas port was loose after tightening up and cleaning the chamber it performs flawlessly
I haven't shot anything over 100 yards but the groups are sub MOA with hornady black and 2" with wolf so i am impressed and I can see great potential
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Hollis - 04-11-2019
poldo Wrote:I am so happy with my BCA 20" SS , bought the complete upper form them
I had some initial problems with cycling steel wolf ammo then realized the gas port was loose after tightening up and cleaning the chamber it performs flawlessly
I haven't shot anything over 100 yards but the groups are sub MOA with hornady black and 2" with wolf so i am impressed and I can see great potential
My BCA Grendel upper is really nice (great look and feel, and cycles flawlessly) but doesn't shoot straight. I'm going to try to see if I can swap the Nitride (only out finish!) barrel out for a stainless steel. Those who say they are pleased with their BCA barrels seem to all be stainless steel. But since the Nitride barrels don't really provide protection of the bore, I see no reason to not have stainless steel.
If I can't get BCA to resolve my problem, I'll probably go with A5's advice and get a new group buy barrel. I do want a straight shooting 6.5 Grendel that I can use for longer distances, but do have budgetary constraints.
20" Bear Creek Arsenal 6.5 Grendel Upper - Rocco_1995 - 04-11-2019
I have a 20 stainless that shoot 1/2 to 3/4 with handloads. I hooked up a 16 nitride for my friend and shot 1.5 off a pack pack with a jacket in it today. I forgot my rest and sandbags.