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+--- Thread: Steel case to brass case (/showthread.php?tid=24633)
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Steel case to brass case - myrifle - 06-17-2022
Well at a crossroads I didnt forsee.
Last few 500 round packages of wolf steel case I bought have had a large amount of bad rounds and a few that when they fired. The case had a small split.
So planning on pulling the bullet and dumping the powder and reloading it into hornady brass I have laying around.
Has anyone on here done it? Changed the steel case out for a brass case?
Steel case to brass case - tlen - 06-17-2022
Why shoot them all then just pull the duds ?
Steel case to brass case - myrifle - 06-18-2022
tlen Wrote:Why shoot them all then just pull the duds ?
How I'm I going to tell if the next round is a dude or if it's a over loaded round and going to cause a case split when fired?
Since the reason for getting rid of the steel case and commie primer for a brass case and cci450 primer.
So has anyone done this? A straight change out from steel case and commie primer too brass case and cci450 primer?
Going too reuse the fmj and the powder.
Steel case to brass case - lazyengineer - 06-18-2022
You could, but the bullets are remarkably low quality. Some barrels do OK with them. What have you been shooting this ammo through, and how well has it been grouping?
Steel case to brass case - grayfox - 06-18-2022
LZ has a point, think there have been a few threads on pulling the bullet and using a 100 grainer you have on hand instead.
Also, haven't looked up but think there could be a comparison on steel case capacity to brass...
But overall since you're using your CZ bolt gun (right?), I'd think it would work out.
Steel case to brass case - myrifle - 06-18-2022
grayfox Wrote:LZ has a point, think there have been a few threads on pulling the bullet and using a 100 grainer you have on hand instead.
Also, haven't looked up but think there could be a comparison on steel case capacity to brass...
But overall since you're using your CZ bolt gun (right?), I'd think it would work out.
No not the bolt.
I will be shooting some later today.
To be clear. I'm not asking about making Moscow match. I simply want to turn my steel case fmj ammo into a brass cased fmj ammo.
Steel case to brass case - Fess - 06-18-2022
The point Grayfox makes is that we do not know how the volume of the steel case compares to the various brass cases available. It is possible that you would end up with an overpressure condition, hence the comment about the bolt rifle, which would tolerate overpressure better.
Steel case to brass case - myrifle - 06-18-2022
Fess Wrote:The point Grayfox makes is that we do not know how the volume of the steel case compares to the various brass cases available. It is possible that you would end up with an overpressure condition, hence the comment about the bolt rifle, which would tolerate overpressure better.
Brass case has a higher case capacity compared to the steel case. Much higher.
My math is coming out at nearly 1.8 grains more case capacity for the beass case. So case volume would be increased and mean a lower pressure.
I pulled down 50 from each of the two 500 hundred round packs in question and it came out to 31 grains average.
I pulled down 50 from a 500 count pack that I purchased in dec of 2019 and 50 from a 500 pack purchased in Feb of 2017 and got the same average of 31 grains.
Same powders.
I was afraid that when barnaul got the word that grendel steel case was going to get banned that their QC would drop and it appears it feel off bad.
These last two 500 round packs have had dude rounds do too primer pockets being too deep and I have multiple rounds in 7 diffrent grendel's over the last 3 months have small splits in the case body. I called it overpressure at first but now I'm thinking it's just piss poor QC manufacturing the steel cases.
I'm not worried about shooting them remade in brass cases in my ar grendels because I built a high pressure testing rig when I was doing bolt breakage testing. It holds the rifle and allows me too make the rifle fire from a safe distance behind cover.
Steel case to brass case - VASCAR2 - 06-18-2022
I have a 16 6.5 Grendel that seems to have a chamber on the large size of spec and in combination to being over gassed I got quite a few split steel cases. I could never see any evidence of a split case by inspecting the chamber. I wondered if the case was splitting as it was extracting and hitting the edge of the receiver or shell deflector. I chalked it up to hot soft steel but never paid much attention. I did notice I rarely got split steel cases in my other AR-15 6.5 Grendel barrels. I have no proof but I suspected the steel cases split after pressures had dropped. All the split cases were longitudinal from the case mouth towards the base in the body of the case. The case split wasnt very large and just reminded me of a metal fatigue crack.
I might get three to four split cases out of twenty round box out of the 16 barrel. With my other barrels Id get one or two split cases in eighty to one hundred rounds. I wouldnt be surprised if split steel cases was more common in over gassed semi autos or when using a suppressor where the dwell time might not be optimal.
Split cases in Wolf/Barnaul steel cases has come up for discussion a few times over the years on this forum. Ive not seen any reports of damage as a result of a split steel case.
Steel case to brass case - myrifle - 06-18-2022
VASCAR2 Wrote:I have a 16 6.5 Grendel that seems to have a chamber on the large size of spec and in combination to being over gassed I got quite a few split steel cases. I could never see any evidence of a split case by inspecting the chamber. I wondered if the case was splitting as it was extracting and hitting the edge of the receiver or shell deflector. I chalked it up to hot soft steel but never paid much attention. I did notice I rarely got split steel cases in my other AR-15 6.5 Grendel barrels. I have no proof but I suspected the steel cases split after pressures had dropped. All the split cases were longitudinal from the case mouth towards the base in the body of the case. The case split wasnt very large and just reminded me of a metal fatigue crack.
I might get three to four split cases out of twenty round box out of the 16 barrel. With my other barrels Id get one or two split cases in eighty to one hundred rounds. I wouldnt be surprised if split steel cases was more common in over gassed semi autos or when using a suppressor where the dwell time might not be optimal.
Split cases in Wolf/Barnaul steel cases has come up for discussion a few times over the years on this forum. Ive not seen any reports of damage as a result of a split steel case.
Yes that's what I'm getting from these last two 500 round packs.
I have had a few over the years do it but never this many rounds. Add to that the primer pockets being to deep.
I literally have 10's of thousands of once fired hornady brass.
So just pulling the bullet/powder and putting them into a brass case with a cci450 would salvage a good bit of plinking ammo for ruffly no price to my pocket book.
Steel case to brass case - Old Bob - 06-18-2022
myrifle... Do you have any Grendel brass that needs fire forming? Seems to me that would be a good use for the bullets & powder you pulled from your steel cases.
Steel case to brass case - myrifle - 06-18-2022
Old Bob Wrote:myrifle... Do you have any Grendel brass that needs fire forming? Seems to me that would be a good use for the bullets & powder you pulled from your steel cases.
Sadly no I dont. That was the first thing to cross my mind but I already fire formed them for my wildcat round.
Steel case to brass case - BluntForceTrauma - 06-18-2022
myrifle Wrote:Last few 500 round packages of wolf steel case I bought have had a large amount of bad rounds and a few that when they fired. The case had a small split.
Also experienced a case split in the latest batch of Wolf 65G steel-case. Also, a few bad primers: they were indented with firing pin, but did not go off. About half of those fired when put back in magazine and cycled again. The other half remained a soft "click" when I pulled the trigger.
Steel case to brass case - myrifle - 06-18-2022
BluntForceTrauma Wrote:Also experienced a case split in the latest batch of Wolf 65G steel-case. Also, a few bad primers: they were indented with firing pin, but did not go off. About half of those fired when put back in magazine and cycled again. The other half remained a soft "click" when I pulled the trigger.
I tryed recycling them but none of them will fire. Same issue primer had been hit and dent well but the primer was driven into the pocket to deep for it to ignite on the anvil.
Got some loaded up in brass now.
31 grains of whatever powder barnaul uses.
Cci450
2.210 for a coal length
Be later in the week before I can fire any of them. No days off for a buisness owner it seems.
Edit to add.
Once fired hornady case from american gunner ammo.
Steel case to brass case - grendelnubi - 06-18-2022
I use the repurposed Wolf Steel cases a lot. I have two loads I use them for. FYI.... this is the H20 volumes I measured for fired cases.
Wolf, 1.514 L, 36.1 H20
Hornady, 1.517 L, 36.1 H20
Starline, 1.51 L, 36.3 H20
Also my pulled powder measures 30 to 30.1 grains of powder with the 100 grain projectile it comes with. I purchased this 500 count Wolf pack about 3 years ago so powder charges may have changed.
Also I have reused the wolf powder for 90 TNT loads and they shoot very good, .75" at 100 yards using 31.6 grains of wolf powder at an average velocity of 2741 fps out of an 18" barrel.
Steel case to brass case - lazyengineer - 06-19-2022
If it's the later batches, then that means >$0.75 Wolf Steel that's misfiring and causing split cases.
Ouch.
I suggest contacting Wolf Customer service, who actually have an excellent reputation of standing behind the product.
Steel case to brass case - myrifle - 06-19-2022
lazyengineer Wrote:If it's the later batches, then that means >$0.75 Wolf Steel that's misfiring and causing split cases.
Ouch.
I suggest contacting Wolf Customer service, who actually have an excellent reputation of standing behind the product.
I would rather make something useful out of them.
Steel case to brass case - lazyengineer - 06-19-2022
grendelnubi Wrote:..
Also I have reused the wolf powder for 90 TNT loads and they shoot very good, .75" at 100 yards using 31.6 grains of wolf powder at an average velocity of 2741 fps out of an 18" barrel.
As a total mindbender, I regularly get single digit SD's out of Wolf Steel Grendel. Sometimes pushing 5 fps SD range. I have no idea how that's even possible, rarely do my reloads do as well.
Steel case to brass case - Growler - 06-19-2022
lazyengineer Wrote:As a total mindbender, I regularly get single digit SD's out of Wolf Steel Grendel. Sometimes pushing 5 fps SD range. I have no idea how that's even possible, rarely do my reloads do as well.
That is interesting. How much of this low SD would you attribute to consistent neck tension or other case properties that may be less variable in steel?
Steel case to brass case - grendelnubi - 06-19-2022
I can tell you this regarding wolf neck tension. It is horribly inconsistent. Some projectiles will pull easily but most do not. Some of this could be due to age however. I use an RCBS puller and there has been several that I have had to use pliers.