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+--- Thread: Help!!! (/showthread.php?tid=2219)
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Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
Just finished my Grendel build. When there is no ammunition the bolt carrier group seats great. When I put rounds in the magazine the bolt carrier group has a small gap. Is this normal? Is this designed like a pistol so that you can see there is a round in the chamber? If not how can I fix this? Should I see if the rifle fires without killing me or disfiguring me? I am attempting to shoot Hornady 123gr A-Max rounds.
Thanks in advance
Help!!! - Whelenon - 02-15-2012
Your right to ask, the bolt should close all the way has if there is no round in the chamber. First we need to find out what you have, please describe your build, list manf. of major components.
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
I have a Spikes Tactical Upper and Lower, Young Manufacturing Stainless Bolt Carrier Group, Satern Barrel and Bolt. Any other required information? I tried to post pictures but don't have a clue how to.
Help!!! - Clod Stomper - 02-15-2012
Are you riding the charging handle home? If so, it's probably not going completely into battery. Stop doing that. Pull it all the way back and release. If that's not the issue, are the bolt and carrier lubed well? If not, get some good lube and wet them down and try it again.
From your post it appears that you are shooting factory rounds. If that is not the case, it could also be your handloads. The shoulder may not be set back far enough. That's a pretty common problem.
Will
P.S.: Do not try to fire a round when it appears that the bolt and carrier aren't in battery. It may be a non-issue or, more likely, it could destroy your rifle and ruin your day.
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
Thanks, but I am not riding the charging handle. I just pull it back and release it. I have lubricated the carrier group and bolt. I am very puzzled that it only does this with a round, and yes I am using factory rounds. I wish I could post pictures.
Help!!! - montana - 02-15-2012
You need to be sure you have a Grendel bolt and not a 5.56. I would order a set of go, no go gauges for the Grendel cartridge. It sounds like you have a head space problem which could be caused by an improper bolt. It's hard to tell without pictures and more detail on your build by what you have written in your post.I would also purchase a 6.5 Grendel case gauge and double check your factory rounds. You will use this if you reload. It isn't impossible for factory rounds to be out of spec. You could also have a tight chamber which could cause this problem. It can be fixed but I wouldn't try to fire it until you are sure the head space and bolt are good to go.
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
Thanks, from what I can tell when I chamber a round, the bolt carrier group is not in battery. I cannot see brass just a small portion of the the bolt and tapping the forward assist does nothing. I wish I knew how to post pictures.
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
[IMG]
![[Image: 2012-02-14_22-37-04_758.jpg]](https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-esjqi4ZgwwM/TzvLqV6l9RI/AAAAAAAAAB8/65PC2vPKfdg/h120/2012-02-14_22-37-04_758.jpg)
This is with no round in Chamber, bolt carrier group goes all the way forward into battery.
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
![[Image: 2012-02-14_22-36-44_434.jpg]](https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-PzZxII_78wY/TzvLi1YbuDI/AAAAAAAAAB0/Kkgpkz5Yzp0/h120/2012-02-14_22-36-44_434.jpg)
This is what Bolt Carrier group does when round is chambered.
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
![[Image: 2012-02-14_12-54-32_548.jpg]](https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Ko0XgRslJ2k/TzvLzJ7xSFI/AAAAAAAAACE/ixo1JHQVdDI/h120/2012-02-14_12-54-32_548.jpg)
This is my build
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
![[Image: 2012-02-14_12-56-28_375.jpg]](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-slEVwQxyglc/TzvL1HyrISI/AAAAAAAAACM/A_xE9Tb8uVE/h120/2012-02-14_12-56-28_375.jpg)
Help!!! - LR1955 - 02-15-2012
Leadfarmer Wrote:
This is what Bolt Carrier group does when round is chambered.
LF:
My opinion.
They gave you a 7.62 X 39 bolt or they didn't ream the chamber deeply enough.
Maybe both combined.
LR55
Help!!! - Hoot - 02-15-2012
Things that come to mind.
When you extract the round that does not allow the bolt to go all the way forward, does it feel like the cartridge is stuck in the chamber, requiring a lot of effort to get it to extract?
Can you chamber a resized, empty case?
Hoot
Help!!! - montana - 02-15-2012
Your rifle is definitely not going into battery. I would follow the steps I suggested in my former post or see a competent gun smith to check it out for you. Good luck.
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
Montana, you hit the nail on the head!!!!! It is a 7.62 x 39 bolt. The 6.5 round wobbles inside the extractor and a 7.62 seats perfectly. The guy on Gunbroker didn't know I guess when he bought them and then sold them to me. Now I need to find a 6.5 Grendel Bolt. Any suggestions? Thanks for all the help guys.
Help!!! - bwaites - 02-15-2012
7.62x39 bolts have the same inside diameter as Grendel bolts, the difference is the depth of the face.
7.62x39 and Grendel brass have the same case head diameter. If Grendel brass wobbles, it shouldn't, unless it isn't going under the extractor?
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
I had a gun smith look at it and he said it is the bolt, that the bolt is the wrong size. It will extract my rounds but the bolt carrier group will not go completely forward. The bullet rests in the barrel, the magazines are correct. The only thing I can think of is the bolt has to be wrong. Sometimes it is very hard to extract the round too, the bolt carrier group gets stuck and you really have to pull on the charging handle to release it.
Help!!! - montana - 02-15-2012
bwaites is correct. You need to make sure you have a Grendel bolt and chamber instead of 7.62X39 bolt and chamber, etc. There are a few people making Grendel type chambers using 7.62X39 bolts that have different head spaces and spec's. They are not compatible with SAMMI Grendel barrels and bolts. I would recommend calling Bill Alexander at Alexander Arms who invented the Grendel. He has been very helpful sorting out this kind of mess created by non Grendel spec manufacturer's like this , if this is your problem. Hope this can help.
Help!!! - Whelenon - 02-15-2012
Check with your local gunsmith, does he have a set of go, no/go gauges for the Grendel? If the go gauge doesn't lock-up you probably have the wrong bolt, most likely the 7.62x39 bolt. For a little discussion on this problem read the following:
http://www.65grendel.com/forum/showthread.php?2167-AR15performance.../page6
Alexander Arms is the best source of information on the Grendel, they developed it.
http://www.alexanderarms.com/
Help!!! - Leadfarmer - 02-15-2012
He did not for the Grendel but he measured it with a caliper and also placed an AK round in the bolt and it held it nice and tight. The Grendel round wobbled in the bolt assembly. I have already ordered a bolt assembly from AA. The barrel is from Satern and is 6.5 Grendel. So, in my understanding if it only takes a bolt and a barrel to make a Grendel and there is nothing wrong with the barrel, then the problem must lie in the bolt assembly. Also he said when you looked at it from underneath you could see the bolt was not fitting properly that it was slightly crooked. I have read your suggested thread and again the bolt I have is undoubtedly a 7.62x39 bolt, I need a Grendel Bolt and have on on order from A/A. Should be here Saturday and problem should be solved. I know that Satern and Lother use A/A Bolts for there Barrels.