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+--- Thread: Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. (/showthread.php?tid=11768)
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - Drift - 09-01-2016
As a 2nd Amendment supporter I see in the news that people in States out west are no longer able to legally buy firearms if they have a medical marijuana card.
The good news is..so far if people were prescribed narcotics are still able to exercise that right. I myself took 2 days of pain medicine after some dental work..and I wonder how long it will take for the above president to be expanded apon by the anti gun lobby.
A suspension of the 2nd Amendment rights of people who are prescribed marijuana is fundamentally no different from the suspension of 2nd Amendment rights from people prescribed pain pills, or sleeping pills or ADD medicine. And I understand that 160,000,000 prescriptions were written for controlled substances last year. In 1 fell swoop half of all Americans may be prevented form legally buying guns.
I submit to the Horde that we need to support 2nd Amendment liberties for all..Even the pot heads have Constitutional rights...and we should support them.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - BMWRider - 09-01-2016
The thought that we have a plant on the schedule I controlled substance list is ludicrous. Don't touch the stuff (too much a control freak) and was a drug warrior for ten years, but this is going to be another way to steal people's natural rights.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - LRRPF52 - 09-02-2016
![[Image: hqdefault.jpg]](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/ndYT-SF7b_0/hqdefault.jpg)
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - A5BLASTER - 09-02-2016
People losing their rights to own a gun of their choice is a outrage, but legal weed is a straight slap in the face to all leo cross this nation and to those who have lost theirs life's due to the drug trade and it's poision.
And I will get flamed for this but I will spit in the face of anyone who stands in front of me and says we need to legalise any drug, my aunt and uncle are with the good Lord because of a drug head trying to score.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - Bigs28 - 09-02-2016
A5, have you ever has an alcoholic beverage? A beer, glass of wine, Jack and coke? Spit in my face. If alcohol is legal which is responsible for roughly 88,000 deaths in the usa every year then marijuana should be. All illicit drugs combined only account for roughly 11,000 deaths annually. I'm sorry for what happened to your family. Blaming weed for it is wildly irresponsible. It would be the same argument some people are making against the ar rifle that the ar kills people when it's actually the bullet and the shooter operating the ar.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - A5BLASTER - 09-02-2016
Yep I have matter of fact I will selebrate 4 years sober this December thanks to AA.
And here's is the difference and the only difference worth talking about between drinking and drugs, drinking is legal and drugs aint.
Now that don't mean I support drinking and driving at all, I did it many times and still have a hard time knowing I could have taken someone's life because I was driving drunk.
And I will stand behind my comment yes I would spit in anyone's face that would stand in front of me and say they support legalizing any controls drug.
No one has to like my views on this subject but it's my view on the subject and it won't change.
And if my view offends anyone maybe you should look deep into one's self and think about why it offends you.
Edit...... never widely accused weed of anything, I accused any and all drugs that are demented illegal, not just weed.
I won't post again on this subject as not to derail it with my personal views anymore then I have already.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - JASmith - 09-02-2016
The problem here is that a marijuana card is seen by many conservatives as a form of proof that the holder is mentally unstable. There is widespread accepatnce that the mentally unfit should not possess firearms, automobiles, knives, baseball bats, bricks, and so on. The denial for legal use of marijuana is seen as a simple extension of keeping guns put of the hands of the mentally unstable. The same logic is attempted when denying the right to bear arms to veterans who need help with forms.
We seem to be forgetting that denying constitutional rights without due process is a big issue.
Regardless of the substance, it being used in a legal way would be not, per se, be grounds for denial of any rights. The individual must see due process. By this the process must include the usual felony due process to include indictment, arrest, trial and conviction.
I am still struggling with how to balance due process with denial for unstable behavior.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - Bigs28 - 09-02-2016
Alcohol is also a drug and marijuana is legal in many places. Congrats on sobriety.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - sneaky one - 09-02-2016
I don't use pot.
Some people use it to help their medical condition as prescribed by a doctor. That's cool.
It should not be sold--- yet to just anyone . More data tests need to be finalized,, it should be finalized soon.
Yes , the govt. should never use a medical card for pot as a reason to deny.
I do agree on the other drugs, that are man made- none are perfect, totally proven to work as planned, what if said prescribee dint take it?????? Conneticut Adam ring a bell ?
Mental health needs to be addressed in this country- also many others- Maybe BWaites can chime in of his med center in WA- people refuse to drive 200 miles for help...
He posted this a while back.
People running loose , that should not be allowed to do that- are THE MAJOR ISSUE IN THE MASS SHOOTINGS, HERE & IN IRAQ, ETC> Give the kids an opp. to get schooling- meds. Vacc. It's just so 3rd effing dumb ass world.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - LRRPF52 - 09-02-2016
The banks don't want marijuana legalized. Right now, they have a production and distribution chain populated with independent contractors who accept all the risk at their stage of the market, with no overhead like normal businesses have.
No worker's comp. No insurance. No HR. But most importantly, no taxes.
It's a huge cash industry that provides capital for investments and real liquidity.
It goes against all the dominant players in the market to legalize, because profits would be crushed if one were to do so.
It also serves as a great vehicle to usurp individual liberties from anyone who partakes, in this instance, self-protection with firearms.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - cory - 09-02-2016
Drift Wrote:As a 2nd Amendment supporter I see in the news that people in States out west are no longer able to legally buy firearms if they have a medical marijuana card.
The good news is..so far if people were prescribed narcotics are still able to exercise that right. I myself took 2 days of pain medicine after some dental work..and I wonder how long it will take for the above president to be expanded apon by the anti gun lobby.
A suspension of the 2nd Amendment rights of people who are prescribed marijuana is fundamentally no different from the suspension of 2nd Amendment rights from people prescribed pain pills, or sleeping pills or ADD medicine. And I understand that 160,000,000 prescriptions were written for controlled substances last year. In 1 fell swoop half of all Americans may be prevented form legally buying guns.
I submit to the Horde that we need to support 2nd Amendment liberties for all..Even the pot heads have Constitutional rights...and we should support them.
JASmith Wrote:The problem here is that a marijuana card is seen by many conservatives as a form of proof that the holder is mentally unstable. There is widespread accepatnce that the mentally unfit should not possess firearms, automobiles, knives, baseball bats, bricks, and so on. The denial for legal use of marijuana is seen as a simple extension of keeping guns put of the hands of the mentally unstable. The same logic is attempted when denying the right to bear arms to veterans who need help with forms.
We seem to be forgetting that denying constitutional rights without due process is a big issue.
Regardless of the substance, it being used in a legal way would be not, per se, be grounds for denial of any rights. The individual must see due process. By this the process must include the usual felony due process to include indictment, arrest, trial and conviction.
I am still struggling with how to balance due process with denial for unstable behavior.
+1 on these.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - cory - 09-02-2016
A5BLASTER Wrote:People losing their rights to own a gun of their choice is a outrage, but legal weed is a straight slap in the face to all leo cross this nation and to those who have lost theirs life's due to the drug trade and it's poision.
And I will get flamed for this but I will spit in the face of anyone who stands in front of me and says we need to legalise any drug, my aunt and uncle are with the good Lord because of a drug head trying to score.
Brother I'm sorry for your loss, but the last part would be a big mistake. Some of us would respond accordingly.
I don't like drugs, people on drugs annoy the absolute hell out of me. However, the fact is prohibition doesn't work. Not to mention my fundamental problem with the government punishing somebody for only harming themselves and no one else. This is a slap in the face to the principles of the Declaration of Independence. I don't need the government keeping me safe from myself.
Let's look at the war on drugs for just a minute. It's very fitting to call it a war. Like war when you can not articulate what victory is, when that victory is not the mission, when you as a nation are not fully committed to achieving that mission (read total war as in WWII) the likely outcome is most certainly a never ending conflict or defeat.
If we as a Nation were to fully commit to ridding this country of drugs* then I'd support it because maybe we could win the war on drugs. As it sits we will not win the war, we are only making it worse. By making these things illegal and not committing to this we are creating a space where a black market and crime can and will thrive, a space where innocent people will often find themselves victims. This half ass effort to fight drugs has done more damage to innocent people and our rights (see asset forfeiture) than drugs themselves ever have. We have given up due process almost entirely.
*I don't consider marijuana a drug in this category. I don't use it nor plan to, but the fact is the effects are less severe than a lot of drugs prescribed by the Drs. I'm no safer being on the road with a pot head as I am a drunk or someone on a lot of prescription drugs. Besides all that, I know other veterans who have use marijuana to deal with insomnia. I've dealt with insomnia myself at times. I refuse to use (prescription) drugs and will not allow myself to become reliant on alcohol or anything. Marijuana does seem to be the lesser of the evils here, does it not? I, myself, suck it up and deal with it. Maybe if I worked in a different field I might consider it at times. So why shouldn't this be my option. Exercising my Liberty, on my own personal property, harming absolutely no one, what grounds does the government have to deny me that right???
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - stanc - 09-02-2016
cory Wrote:Brother I'm sorry for your loss, but the last part would be a big mistake. Some of us would respond accordingly.And rightly so. His attitude is irrational and emotional.
Quote:If we as a Nation were to fully commit to ridding this country of drugs* then I'd support it because maybe we could win the war on drugs. As it sits we will not win the war, we are only making it worse. By making these things illegal and not committing to this we are creating a space where a black market and crime can and will thrive...Commitment is irrelevant. Making something illegal is what causes a black market to be created. It's the law of supply and demand.
Prohibiting drugs -- like making booze illegal in the 1920s -- does not eliminate the demand, and the criminal element always steps in to provide the supply of the banned substance.
The "commitment" that would be required to completely eliminate sale and use of drugs could only be had with a ruthless, totalitarian government which would make Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union look like the Girl Scouts in comparison.
Quote:Exercising my Liberty, on my own personal property, harming absolutely no one, what grounds does the government have to deny me that right???It's called, "Might makes right." Government has the power to do it. Grounds are irrelevant.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - win.308stealth - 09-02-2016
http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/10/marijuana-related-fatal-car-accidents-surge-washin/
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - montana - 09-02-2016
The issue is not guns, drugs, alcohol, or right and wrong but freedom. In a free society, people have the right to make choices involving their lives. If the choices are good or bad is relevant only to each individual. On the other side of the freedom coin is responsibility and accountability. A free person is also responsible and held accountable for their choices and actions. To detract from choices is to detract from freedom. To detract from accountability is also to detract from freedom.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - cory - 09-02-2016
win.308stealth Wrote:http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/10/marijuana-related-fatal-car-accidents-surge-washin/
Quote:The fatal crash study does not determine whether drivers were impaired, and it notes that there was no sign of an increase in fatal crashes among those with marijuana in their systems until a full 39 weeks after marijuana possession was legalized in the state.
Just because they tested positive, it doesn't necessarily mean they had smoked in the last 24hrs. THC can stay in your system up to a month.
So let me get this straight for a minute. If you have a medical marijuana card they take away your right to arm yourself, but they don't take your license to drive. It seems to me that if you're to much of a danger to have a gun you're far to much of a danger to be driving a vehicle that is equally as deadly as a weapon.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - JASmith - 09-02-2016
cory Wrote:...So let me get this straight for a minute. If you have a medical marijuana card they take away your right to arm yourself, but they don't take your license to drive. It seems to me that if you're to much of a danger to have a gun you're far to much of a danger to be driving a vehicle that is equally as deadly as a weapon.Ayup!!!
Also, having a drivers license is a privilege in just about and possibly every state.
Another indicator that "public safety" concerns again being used to further a troubling agenda.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - stanc - 09-02-2016
JASmith Wrote:Ayup!!!The government defines what is a "right" and what is a privilege, and there is negligible practical difference between the two.
Also, having a drivers license is a privilege in just about and possibly every state.
Just like privileges, so-called "rights" can be restricted, or even completely denied to individuals.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - BMWRider - 09-02-2016
JASmith Wrote:Also, having a drivers license is a privilege in just about and possibly every state.
Well they say it is anyway, the courts have ruled repeatedly that driving is a right. But a mis-truth repeated often enough....
The problem in this discussion is the irrational response that a few have. Cannabis is a plant. It has been used medicinally and as a recreational substance during all recorded history. It is by no means a drug anymore so than basil is. Contrary to the lies of many, it is not nearly the gateway drug that alcohol is either. Logic and reason need to prevail and government needs to stop meddling.
I fought the drug war (as I said earlier) for ten years of my life. I busted smugglers of both cocaine and cannabis. If someone spits in your face because he thinks he is defending me, he is a fool. Most of us on the frontlines of the drug war (I was there in the 80s and 90s) saw it for what it was, a way to steal your rights. Real drugs are brought into this country by means that are almost "un-interceptable." Cannabis was made illegal initially for very racist reasons, it was the recreational substance of choice by many in minority communities. Since it truly is a weed it could not be taxed and the government saw it as a revenue loss. White people didn't use it so they didn't care. LSD, opiates, and many other real drugs were legal long after cannabis was outlawed. My point? Just as gun laws have their roots in racism, so do laws regarding cannabis. I wish people would do more research before spouting off about completely disrespecting someone.
Ahh... I think we need to get marijuana legalized. - Drift - 09-03-2016
When I started this tread, part of my point was that both the NRA and NORMAL claim to support individual liberties. And most of us agree that there is indeed some (perhaps a lot), of overlap in our philosophies Yet the NRA continues to loose ground and NORMAL is making great strides. Clearly, they are doing something right, and we are doing something wrong.
I think its time that we extend a hand to the pot heads and tell them we gun owners support them in exercising their God given rights; and asking them for their help in exercising ours.