Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 41

Thread: 6.5 vs 308 Win

  1. #1
    DangerClose
    Guest

    6.5 vs 308 Win

    Given this is a grendel forum, but what would you consider a better overall hunting cartridge. Data is great, but I'd like to hear from guys who have used both. Im new to the grendel, but ive used 308 and loved it for Texas deer and hog.

    Thoughts?

  2. #2
    Chieftain Variable's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NRA/GOA/SAF Life.... West Virginia
    Posts
    2,399
    Well, you didn't mention whether you were constrained to an AR15 magazine well or not...

    Are we talking semi? Bolt gun? In Texas, you don't have anything that a Grendel won't readily drop, and it is usable in lighter semi platforms. So, I'd go Grendel personally. In a bolt gun I'd probably use a .260 Remington.

    But.... I'm not going to say the Grendel is "better". It depends on what platform you choose. You also won't pop into wally world to pick up a box in a pinch.

  3. #3
    Nimrod
    Guest
    Considering the question as it was asked, the .308 Win is the better overall hunting cartridge. Where I live there are very large moose and even bigger bears that the ;308 would be better suited for. But I love my .264 LBC.

  4. #4
    pappy42
    Guest
    apples to apples; the .308 is "better". Variable's answer hit's the nail on the head.

  5. #5
    JASmith
    Guest
    Or, we could complicate the discussion and start a comparative list like this:

    • Larger Game: +.308
    • Trajectories: +Grendel or +.308 depending on bullet choices
    • Cost of Factory Ammo: +.308
    • Cost of Reloads: +Grendel (provided you're using your own once-fired brass)
    • Light Platforms: +Grendel
    • Low Recoil: +Grendel
    • Fun Shooting: +Grendel.


    The list can be expanded, but as a couple of folks said in other words, the quality of the sauce depends on your taste buds!

  6. #6
    Moderator bwaites's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NRA Member, SAF Member Central Washington State
    Posts
    4,424
    Cost of factory ammo: Assuming comparable quality loads is tossup. I haven't seen Hornady .308 AMAX any less expensive than Grendel AMAX. High quality .308 for hunting runs about the same as factory Grendel loadings for hunting.
    Last edited by bwaites; 08-10-2011 at 03:56 PM.
    ”You seek escape from pain. We seek the achievement of happiness. You exist for the sake of avoiding punishment. We exist for the sake of earning rewards. Threats will not make us function; fear is not our incentive. It is not death that we wish to avoid, but life that we wish to live.” - John Galt

  7. #7
    JASmith
    Guest
    Premium ammo does indeed level the playing field.

    I was thinking of the real inexpensive stuff like Tul Ammo in .308 at under $10.00/box.

    I was, however, surprised at the minor differences in standard brands. In fact I discovered that the Grendel is less expensive in Wolf brand than is the .308 in Wolf brand.

    I guess I can say that you got me again!!

  8. #8
    ss355
    Guest
    I essentially concur with what others already posted. The 308 is probably a better "overall" hunting cartridge in the sense that it's capable of taking larger game than the Grendel. However, "better" comes with a price--increased recoil and increased weight, if we're talking semi-autos, particularly the AR-10 style guns versus the AR-15.

    The last time I went hunting, ostensibly for hogs, I toted around a scoped FAL with 18.5" tube. That beast got heavy, and that's when I swore to myself that I'd have a lighter gun the next time. That's one of the reasons I went the Grendel route.

    Oh, and go Red Raiders!

  9. #9
    LRRPF52
    Guest
    I have used and owned a lot of .308's in bolt guns and AR10's, and for hunting, the AR10 in .308 is a not-starter, unless you go with a really lightweight barrel and components. All my AR10's in .308 have been "long-range" rifles with heavy barrels, until I finally got it through my head that .308 is not a long-range cartridge, even when I pushed the 155gr Lapua Scenars at 2850 fps. It's a capable 600m cartridge, but the wind blows it all over the place after that.

    As a result, I only plan to build AR10's in 6.5mm from now on, like the .260 Rem I am using in one currently. That is a cartridge that justifies the weight and profile of a .308 action, whether bolt or semi-auto, and has much less recoil as well.

    The Grendel allows you to have a very handy, lightweight carbine or rifle that delivers .308 trajectories and sufficient terminal ballistics to take even large game within 400yds, with half the recoil of most .308 loads. You also use a lot less powder when reloading, and there are a lot of 6.5mm bullets to choose from on the market. If you are shooting hogs or other fast-movers, the Grendel will allow faster follow-up shots than a .308, similarly-configured.

    While most .308 hunting rifles are of a lightweight profile, they are not fun for younger shooters to practice on with any significant round count to develop a solid level of proficiency. Not so with the Grendel. It is a pussycat to shoot, even for the kids.

    For making ethical kills with both calibers, which are usually done well within 300yds, I don't think either caliber exhibits significant advantages over the other, so I personally lean to the Grendel for its field friendliness for ease of carry.

  10. #10
    Moderator bwaites's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NRA Member, SAF Member Central Washington State
    Posts
    4,424
    Picking a "better" cartridge is tough, regardless of the caliber. To take this to a greater extreme; Which is better for hunting, the .22 LR or the .308?

    More deer have been taken with the .22 LR than the .308, believe it or not. BUT is it the ideal cartridge for that? Nope. Is the .308, again, I would say no. There isn't an IDEAL cartridge out there.

    Choosing between the two for deer and hogs, I'd pick the Grendel every time...for the reasons that LRRPF52 states. Less recoil, lighter weight, (Yes, I realize you can build an AR10 almost as light as an AR15.), easier followup shots. And also because you can reload for 50% less powder and cheaper bullets.

    For those reasons, and for hunting inside 3-400 yards, the Grendel is really hard to beat on medium sized game.

    BUT...some people think you have to use 300 WinMags on deer and hogs....so its a very personal decision!!
    ”You seek escape from pain. We seek the achievement of happiness. You exist for the sake of avoiding punishment. We exist for the sake of earning rewards. Threats will not make us function; fear is not our incentive. It is not death that we wish to avoid, but life that we wish to live.” - John Galt

  11. #11
    warped
    Guest
    Some people need a .300win mag for deer weighing around 100-125lbs, to me this indicates two things, poor shooting ability and the other thing...

  12. #12
    MrSurgicalPrecision
    Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by warped View Post
    Some people need a .300win mag for deer weighing around 100-125lbs, to me this indicates two things, poor shooting ability and the other thing...
    So you're saying I shouldn't be hunting coyotes with my .338 Lapua? Dang it!

    Personally if I were in Texas I'd be hunting with my Grendel and not my .308. Up here in Missouri I use both. I like the .308 for the larger bodied whitetails but the Grendel does the job adequately as well.

  13. #13
    260_Shooter
    Guest
    I like hog hunting at night with an AR type rifle and have experimented with 5.56, 300 Blackout, 6.8 and .308, so my comments are in context of rapid, short distance shots supplemented with the rarer long shot. Because running hogs are generally difficult to stop with a body shot (and running head shots are hard to make), I have found a light, handy weapon with minimal recoil and faster shot recovery to be generally the most effective. My AR-10 has made some impressively devastating first shot precision kills, but once the rest start to run it's been really hard to do much with a rifle that starts at 10 pounds before glass & suppressor go on. When the game turns into make your shots count during a 100 yard sprint for cover, flatter trajectory, faster shots and rifle handiness always serve the shooter better than a single 180 gr dumptruck punched broadside through the chest.

    From that standpoint, the Grendel looks like the perfect chambering for the task of AR pig hunting. Its efficient, low recoil and fits into the lighter, handier rifle. It shoots flat and accurately delivers moderate energy with a good range of projectiles. It's much better suited than 5.56 for a 300 yard shot, but doesn't require a gun so heavy you are too tired to make it when the time comes. It should still perform well with barrels down to 14 or even 12 inches long, if you desire a suppressed weapon that is the same length as a standard rifle and won't reduce the service life of your suppressor like a .308 SBR will.

    My No.1 complaint with the Grendel (and 6.8) in an AR is the cost of brass - it's just a bit pricey to kick out of the chamber and into a field. My No.2 complaint is the 9/16 muzzle thread pattern - you can't use the more widely available 5/8 thread pattern accessories. Given the difficulty and cost of obtaining a suppressor, it would be nice to just screw a .308 can on the end and go shooting. The first complaint will remedy itself as the cartridge becomes more popular. Both of these issues are minor and heavily outweighed by the ballistics and accuracy inherent to the Grendel.

  14. #14
    jwilson1985
    Guest
    ive had both aswell but ive got to go with grendel i long range shoot and there is no deer or predator it wont take down

  15. #15
    LRRPF52
    Guest
    Those are some very good points I hadn't thought about with suppressor use. The Grendel will be a lot easier on your baffle arrangement than a 16" barreled .308, or even a 6.8 since the Grendel runs lower pressures. I also wish 5/8x24 was the standard thread pattern for the Grendel, but that can be remedied and probably should be cut specifically for cans anyway by a competent smith, or the can-maker.

    Another thing that is nice is that a Grendel with the exact barrel profile of a 5.56 AR and all other things equal, will be lighter due to the large bore diameter, so there are some weight benefits of looking for a lighter hunter.

    At hog-hunting distances, there is no difference between the 5.56, Grendel, 6.8, and .308. The Grendel just gives you the downrange trajectory benefits when you want to reach out for those deer or yotes, delivering a heavier pill than the 5.56 or 6.8 can if you want.

    Owning a Grendel has made .308 AR10's obsolete for me. I have a .30 cal pipe sitting around right now with no plans for a home, because it's pointless now.

  16. #16
    warped
    Guest
    I am down to only one .308win weapon.

    The FAL just has to stay.

    Anything else in that size would be better off as a .260rem or 6.5x47 Lapua, hell even the 7mm08 is better than a .308win

  17. #17
    LRRPF52
    Guest
    The only AR10 in 7.62 NATO I will own will be an original Armalite or Dutch when I can afford one for collector's purposes. That is a piece of history. It's interesting that the FAL and AR10 performed better than the T44 (later type-classified as the M14) in the mid 1950's for the service rifle trials, yet the M14 was selected, since Army Ordnance had "designed" it themselves (really a Garand with a less-reliable gas system and detachable box mag).

    It really is too bad the Brits didn't succeed in standardizing the .280 Enfield, or a 6.5mm intermediate cartridge back then for NATO, with the clout of the US in favor of the 7.62x51 influencing the standard NATO rifle caliber. Coulda shoulda woulda...

  18. #18
    Moderator bwaites's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NRA Member, SAF Member Central Washington State
    Posts
    4,424
    If I owned an AR10 style rifle it would be in 6.5x47 Lapua over the .260. Someday that is the the plan. I'd like to own the big brother, too!

    260 Rem is a good caliber, but I don't think the case is as efficient as the Lapua case design, making it more difficult to bring to ultimate accuracy. Brass for the .260 is easier to find, though!
    ”You seek escape from pain. We seek the achievement of happiness. You exist for the sake of avoiding punishment. We exist for the sake of earning rewards. Threats will not make us function; fear is not our incentive. It is not death that we wish to avoid, but life that we wish to live.” - John Galt

  19. #19
    Moderator bwaites's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    NRA Member, SAF Member Central Washington State
    Posts
    4,424
    Quote Originally Posted by MrSurgicalPrecision View Post
    So you're saying I shouldn't be hunting coyotes with my .338 Lapua? Dang it!

    Personally if I were in Texas I'd be hunting with my Grendel and not my .308. Up here in Missouri I use both. I like the .308 for the larger bodied whitetails but the Grendel does the job adequately as well.
    You can hunt coyotes with a howitzer! The more the merrier as far as I am concerned!

    I'm pretty sure that the Grendel will work on ANY whitetail. If it will drop an elk at 400 yards, chances of it not doing the same to deer are slim and none. (Of course actually hitting the deer is the first objective!)
    ”You seek escape from pain. We seek the achievement of happiness. You exist for the sake of avoiding punishment. We exist for the sake of earning rewards. Threats will not make us function; fear is not our incentive. It is not death that we wish to avoid, but life that we wish to live.” - John Galt

  20. #20
    warped
    Guest
    Yep, the Brits had the right rifle and actually had enough data to select a 6.5 cartridge had they been given enough time to do some thorough testing.

    That entire selection was rammed down the throats of everyone involved and AO was wrong yet again

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •